What NOT to do When Being Pulled Over

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What NOT to do When Being Pulled Over

The other day we shared some insights that could help you when pulled over by the police. Now it’s time to cover a few of the things you absolutely should not do during a traffic stop. Hopefully you take notes; this could save you a lot of trouble during your next brush with the law.

OJ Simpson ChaseOnce again we spoke to Sgt. Andy Breidenich, public information officer with the Troy, Mich. Police Department. During our chat one of the first things he mentioned involved pulling over promptly. When you see roof-mounted blinkers on your six stop as soon as it’s safe to do so. “Don’t let the officer initiate a pursuit,” he said. They may think you’re trying to evade arrest and that’s really bad, plus you don’t want to end up on the evening news like some two-bit O.J. Simpson.

Beyond this Breidenich said, “Don’t be reaching for a bunch of stuff when the officer is walking up.” Understandably this can be perceived as a threat. They don’t know if you’re merely getting your license and registration out or if you’re un-holstering a Glock. As I wrote before, it’s best to keep your hands on the steering wheel so they’re clearly visible as they walk up.

Another helpful suggestion Breidenich made is not to lie. “One thing cops are really good at is a BS meter,” he said. They deal with strangers on a daily basis and often some pretty unsavory characters at that. After doing police work for a while, they really learn how to read people so make sure not to tell tall tales during traffic stops, plus lying is just plain mean and it’s not “respectful of the law.”

Another policing pet peeve Breidenich mentioned is quarrelsome drivers. “Don’t argue with the officer even if you think you’re right,” he said. There’s a time and a place to share your side of the story; it’s called court, not the shoulder of the highway at 2:00 in the morning. If you’ve been issued a citation accept it and deal with the ticket at a later date.

SEE ALSO: Cops Love Ford’s Police Interceptor SUV

Pulled OverBut perhaps even more important than these suggestions Breidenich said, “Don’t get out of your car and approach the officer, that’s a big no-no.” Going on he said, “It’s very unusual and very unnerving for a police officer.” Naturally this goes for passengers as well. They should remain seated in the vehicle throughout  the stop.

Breidenich also said there should be “only one voice in the car,” so make sure your passengers keep quiet while you’re talking to the officer. Several people yammering over each other at the same time is irritating and makes the officer’s job more difficult, something that will only make them less likely to cut you slack.

Naturally a little common sense goes a long way in these situations. Don’t have loud music blaring even if your ride has a kick-ass sound system, don’t keep talking on your cell phone during the stop and please don’t have illegal substances in your car or on your person. None of these things will do you any favors.

SEE ALSO: What TO DO When Being Pulled Over

As always remember the golden rule; treat others the way you’d like to be treated. It works well during traffic stops and life in general. If you cooperate with the police and are not rude, disrespectful or otherwise irritating the officer handling the situation may be willing to let you go with a reduced citation or perhaps just a warning.

GALLERY: 2015 Dodge Charger Pursuit

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  • smartacus

    What NOT to do when you pull someone over:
    Don’t shoot minivans full kids moving in a direction AWAY from you
    Don’t shoot pickups that “match description”
    Don’t shoot unarmed suspects

    When responding to a house don’t always shoot the family dog (or at least not when the horrified children are watching)

    While on a raid; Don’t just make sure it’s pre-dawn and no-knock. Make sure it’s also the right house before killing people in their beds

  • smartacus

    And no, your gun and badge don’t protect you from child sex laws

    http://www.policemisconduct.net/

  • smartacus

    And don’t break the necks of scary unstable threatening 90 year old vets on the street, even if you don’t get in the least bit of trouble over it and shamelessly blame the guy

  • Disqus11111

    More like Dumbacus.

  • smartacus

    And i hope you stop sucking dicks after they ejaculate in your anus.

  • http://messengerpuppet.com/ Messenger Puppet

    thanks for that mental picture

  • James

    It all boils down to the concept of “You get what you give.” (There ARE exceptions,but those are going to go bad no matter WHAT you do.) Start off being an a$$hole and you’re not doing EITHER of you any good.

  • Robert L. Rice

    AND if you are carrying a legal concealed weapon,inform the officer. and after informing the officer,THEN,and only then,remove your wallet and show your CCW permit…

  • kirk

    Uhhh, no. If you’re pulled over, politely say “I don’t wish to answer any questions”. Identify yourself, don’t consent to any searches, and if they keep asking you questions, ask the magic words “am I being detained, or am I free to go?”

    Police are there to generate revenue, seize property and protect themselves. Some rare times they protect or serve the public. They don’t pull you over to have a stimulating conversation, they are there to get your money or perhaps your freedom if you’re not smart. The reason your pulse quickens a little when you see those blue lights? That’s self preservation. Listen to that.

    My friend was dumb enough to believe they were there to help. They thought his homeopathic stomach pills from Whole Foods were ecstasy. Ten months later when they finally tested negative for drugs, he was released from jail to what little life he had left. Don’t be foolish like that and let them search or talk to them. They’re not pulling you over to make friends.

  • Nick Russo

    Basically, what he says is: cops are of a mighty divine status, well above a simple human being, and they dont like being questioned for their mostly irritating attitude, and overall, dont even think of being in the right if i say youre wrong. So much for democracy.
    If we were to treat others like others treat us we should basically tell him to go fuck a donkey.
    Whoever put that guy into p.r. should go clean the floors.

  • Jagman

    after reading the comments, I think that author of this article should go back to reality school. Police don’t have that great a reputation and for cause. I find them mostly liars and cheats but that’s just my opinion.

  • RiverMikeRat

    Cops are full of shit. They can no better detect a lie than the average Joe. And because they have a badge and we don’t, they can get away with more and bigger lies and always do.

    Also, why respect cops when they don’t respect us?

    Do what I do: Keep this thought in mind: A citizen is someone that knows and understands the laws of the state they live in. A subject is someone who doesn’t. I prefer to be a citizen.

    Read and understand your state’s vehicle code.

  • lou

    my gripe is , and I was a motocycle cop for ten years, is why cops spend so much time on the side of the road waiting for the average joe driving home from work..Instead spend time driving through shopping centers, bne seen , deter thefts, and make people feel safer shopping ..Also stop and talk to kids, be friendly not an asshole, get to know the neighborhood people, stop and talk, I got to know who was doing what to who, and it doesn’t take much to make friends with the “guys” ..Instaead of giving out speeding tcikets..Grow up,,its a badge not a almighty power emblem to harass people who are just trying to het home..

  • http://www.sparechange.com Thomas Brinkley

    Wow!!

    I think its a two way street though. I’m never rude or argue with the police.

    But the few times in my life I have been pulled over the officer has never been polite, courteous, respectful. I feel like i’m being pulled over by a soldier not a PEACE officer!

    This whole warning by the cops article could have been summed up in six words, “any sudden move and your dead”.

  • lou

    they got a picture of my police motorcycle with all the choppers at the club ..
    Its on the wall..and everyone asks..so wheer ‘d you guys steal the police Harley ?
    It was a good ride,,
    , the n one day , realized I out grew the job,I can write a book, !!
    .

  • Ken M

    I am certainly wondering what happened to the police saying ” Protect and Serve” and where all of that went in Ferguson. Then what about constitutional rights for the media , only two people in a McDonald’s and they arrest them for doing what I see all over world people doing and never hassled or rights violated. I have been in China, Russia, Ukraine, Germany, France, USA and many more and not one time can I ever remember not one person charging equipment, EVER! No real information and seemingly made up stories by police. Just very ugly for American freedoms!

  • joe blow

    sounds like fun if they are hung and black

  • Mat Boonen

    Police the Gang of “democracy”

  • BB

    It worries me that the Canadian police are becoming more and more like the Amarican versions, shoot and ask questions later. We should try to take away their guns and see how their attitudes change when stop one for a traffic violation.

  • Ernie

    Don’t answer any questions – especially ones like “where are you headed?” or “Have you had anything to drink?”. It’s none of the cop’s business where I’m headed, and you should NOT admit to drinking alcohol, even if you have. That is called a confession. Cops are sneaky, lying bastards and will use whatever deceitful tactic they think will accomplish their goal.

  • Ernie

    You nailed it kirk!

  • mindbender1946

    Good grief, some of the comments here are just plain scary.

    Be polite when the officer approaches. Respect is more likely to get respect.

    Offer your ID, don’t make him/her ask. That shows you are willing to cooperate.

    You might even ask in a sad tone, “Have I done something wrong? That sets the tone for convincing the officer you may actually not have broken the law on purpose. And it sends the message you may truly be sorry for messing up.

    After that, you can then plead your record. “Officer, I haven’t had a ticket in thirty years. Is there a chance I might only get a warning?

    But you have to actually HAVE a clean record for that to work.

    I have not been stopped by police since 1978. Why? I use my speed control set AT the limit. I use my turn signal faithfully. I actually STOP at stop signs.

    if you find those things troublesome…………..you deserve a ticket.

  • William

    A lot of drivers are sneaky, lying bastards and will use whatever deceitful tactic they think will get them out of a ticket that they just rightfully earned also.

  • Ernie

    The difference, of course, is that the driver does not have the ability to deprive the cop of his liberty. Any cop who thinks his primary duty is to issue tickets or make arrests has no business being a cop. Your reply, William, might make one believe you are one of those sneaky, lying bastard cops I spoke of.

  • William

    Nope sorry not a cop. Just an honest person who never got a ticket he didn’t deserve. I take it by your first post that you find it okay to drink and drive.

  • Ernie

    If you truly can draw that conclusion, then you are also either very arrogant or extremely stupid!

  • Arthur Dunning III

    Wouldn’t refusing to answer questions make cops suspicious? Also, wouldn’t it be ill-advised to drink and drive?

  • Ernie

    Did I suggest that drinking and driving is a good idea? It only makes them suspicious because they assume everyone is as crooked as they are. What is ill-advised is giving them ANY information about yourself – in fact, the US Constitution (5th Amendment) guarantees that you cannot be compelled to do so.

    Here’s a very realistic scenario: A cop asks if you’ve had anything to drink, and you reply “I had a beer a little while ago”. What gets written in the cop’s report is “Subject admitted to drinking alcohol”. That is called a confession, and is NEVER a good idea. As a lawyer once told me: “You shouldn’t plead guilty to stealing the church, even if the steeple is sticking out of your “ash”. The best thing is to politely advise the cop that you do not wish to answer any questions, and ask whether you are being detained or are free to go. They don’t like it much – no bully likes to be challenged – but there isn’t a whole lot they can do, unless they have some good evidence against you.

  • TM

    Drinking and driving is not illegal. DWI and DUI are illegal. There is a big difference.

  • Alex_nma

    One important thing to keep in mind is that it is against the law for you to lie to the police. BUT, it is perfectly acceptable for them to lie to you. So, keep that in mind when talking to the cops.

  • Alex_nma

    Really? If that is really the case, why is it illegal to lie to cop but perfectly legal for a cop to lie to you? To me that says don’t believe everything a cop tells you as the law says it is ok for them to lie to you.

  • Ernie

    You are right, but if you don’t answer ANY questions, then your point becomes moot.

  • Alex_nma

    Just remember you have to let them know you are asserting your right to remain silent. Yes, you have to tell them otherwise the courts have decided that you are not asserting your right to remain silent.

  • StevenLNew

    And it’s people like you who makes being a police officer harder. Most police officers are not lying bastards… It’s drunks like you who get caught who feel that way.
    Just because you have been drinking and tell me you have, doesn’t mean I’m taking you to jail. If you tell me you’ve been drinking and I feel you have control over your vehicle, I will probably let you go on. If you are past out in the middle of an intersection… Well you are probably going to jail no matter what you tell me.
    My goal as you call it, is to make sure my city is safe… That’s it. I don’t need a drunk like you killing someone or yourself.

  • StevenLNew

    Hmmm not sure what police officers you have delt with, but most police officers don’t lie. (not saying there are none) I have been tanked several times for being honest with people. Even while taking them to jail, I’ve been told I was a cool cop. I have no reason to lie about anything. If I saw you run a red light… I saw you run a red light. I rarely write tickets but when I do, they are good tickets. If you are driving like an idot when I pull you over then ask me why I pulled you over? Ticket.
    I caught a kid last tear who was getting his car ready for the high school drag race… Running a Mustang with open headers blowing off his tires. After pulling him over I asked what do you think you are doing. he told he just got his engine in his car and wanted to see how it was running. I told him it sounded great and to get it home. No ticket, no impound lot either.

  • StevenLNew

    Your point doesn’t become moot. In most cases if I ask you were you are heading, it’s because we are trying to get the story correct. If I begin asking lots of questions, I have already read you your rights.
    Most people don’t understand… They think I have to read you your rights when I arrest you. Simply NOT true. I only read you your rights if I start questioning when I’m arresting you. Which I rarely do, most of the time people offer up way to much info. I’ve even stopped people from telling me things, by reading them their rights. So hopefully they catch on. (shut up)

  • StevenLNew

    Agreed

  • StevenLNew

    Ernie, you have know clue obviously. If you are passed out behind the wheel in the middle of an intersection and you tell me you had one beer? You were more than likely lying. If you tell me you had one beer and I think you have control of your vehicle? I’m probably going to tell you to drive safe and have a good day.
    If I begen to question you while I’m taking you into custody… I’ve will read you your rights… Then and only then when you tell me you had 6 beers, does that become a confession.
    I will say, if you just shot and killed someone, I will state in my report that you told me that… It’s still not a confession. It’s evidents to keep you detained and more than likely arrest you, but it’s not a confession until you have been read your rights (usually by our detectives) and you actually confess to your crime. Until then it is just probably cause.

  • StevenLNew

    Alex… That is a STUPID question!!! Why is it illegal to lie to the police? How about stop thinking like a crook and think like a normal person.
    If everyone lied to the police there would be people getting arrested for all kinds of things they were not even envolved in.
    My last arrest for giving false information, they lady was actually being booked for bad checks, only to find out she was forging her sisters signature. So she was eventually booked on idenity theft and giving false information to the police. It took us 3 days to get it all figured out, that’s why it’s illegal to lie to the police. It’s not rocket science.
    The only people who lie to the police are people who are up to no good. plain and simple.

  • Ernie

    Well, shlt for brains, if you are really interested, I haven’t consumed a single drink of alcohol in nearly 30 years, so your “drunk like you” statement just makes you sound even more like the lying bastard cops I mentioned earlier. You came to that conclusion based on some internal prejudice, and not on facts. Here is a another fact for you: you may not compel me to answer your buIIshlt questions, and until you good for nothing cops start acting like public servants, you deserve having your job made harder. There have been hundreds, yes hundreds, of people sentenced to long prison terms, and even death because of some lying bastard cop. Your job is made harder because when you abuse your authority, you lose the respect and cooperation of people like me. There was a time that I didn’t feel this way, but jerks like you brought a change of heart. Here’s a quick test to give yourself – do you refer to the general public as “civilians”? If you do, the you are certainly part of the problem, because (here is another of those pesky facts) YOU are a civilian, too.

  • Ernie

    About a month ago, I was driving home after an evening with friends. (As I mentioned earlier, I do not drink alcohol – not at all, not ever.) At about midnight, with about an hour left to drive, I began feeling drowsy and decided to stop in a parking area (which is privately owned, by the way) to sleep for a little while, so that I could be alert for the rest of my drive. Within 15 minutes, a cop came to harass me with a bunch of buIIshlt questions which were apropos of nothing. Mind you, I was in a stationary vehicle on private property, no laws were being violated. The only thing being violated was my right to some peace and quiet. There was no “story” to get correct – I was drowsy and stopped to rest,
    and since I was on private property, there had been no complaint, and
    there was no evidence of any wrongdoing, it’s none of that azzhole’s
    business why I was there. If you shlthead cops want some respect and cooperation, I would suggest you stop assuming that every person you come in contact with is a criminal, or a drunk, or whatever else comes up in your imagination. You will get the respect you deserve, and no more.

    You can keep right on with your sanctimonious approach, and keep harassing people and I’ll continue to make your job as difficult as I can. As I said before, if you want cooperation from me, stop treating me like a suspect.

  • StevenLNew

    Well, 1st off… What makes them BS questions?!?!?!? Because you didn’t like them? Maybe where you were parked had been having a lot of issues? Maybe he was on a hunt for a car just like your that was involved in another incident?!?!?!
    Maybe the owner of the “privately own parking lot” complained?!?!
    It is people like you who make things harder for the police.
    If you did nothing wrong which it sounds like you didn’t… You have nothing to worry about… be honset answer his questions and go back to sleep… End of story, but no… You want to make it out like the police was in the wrong. Maybe he was, maybe he wasn’t. Not EVERY policeman is out to get you!!!
    Grow up.

  • Alex_nma

    I didn’t say all cops lie. I said there is no legal reason for a cop to not lie to you. There is a legal reason for you to not lie to cop. Most cops are reasonable folks. A few are not, so you need to watch out for those.

  • StevenLNew

    Also… We have to think everyone we come in contact with is a possible threat… The one time we don’t we die. You wouldn’t understand I know.

  • StevenLNew

    I would agree… The police should not be lying to anyone.
    Our department IS HUGE on getting rid of officers who lie. If you are disshonest it’s next to impossible to testify in the court of law.

  • Alex_nma

    You missed the point. William is calling average citizens deceitful, but cops will lie to you to get you to confess to something. I’ve had it happen. I’m not positive if the lie was him lying to me or just his ignorance, but it really makes no difference the information they gave me was false. When you give information to a police office you need to be very careful as giving bad information can get you in trouble. The police have no such worries.

  • StevenLNew

    You don’t have to tell the police you are asserting your right to remain silent. BUT if you might have done something wrong, or we think it’s possible, and you refuse to give us your name… You will go to jail and get finger printed so we can find out exactly who we are dealing with. You may be wanted in another state… you could be a wanted terrorist… We don’t know, so we need to find out.
    If you haven’t done anything wrong, you don’t have anything to worry about.

  • StevenLNew

    I didn’t miss the point… I got the point. Your average police officer on the street doesn’t lie to you so you will confess and we take you to jail.
    I have seen were during an investigation. (2 individuals in jail) were the detective might tell one guy his buddy ratted them out, so that guy may confess the whole truth. That’s just detective work, but your avarage policeman on the street doesn’t work like that.

  • Ernie

    No, fool, it is YOU who needs to grow up and get off your high horse. Perhaps you haven’t heard of the “presumption of innocence”, or perhaps you choose to ignore that theory. You see, I am old enough to remember when police officers did NOT assume that everyone was a criminal. When they saw a person snoozing in a car, provided there wasn’t an obvious problem, they went on about their business. In any of the scenarios you proposed, the cop could easily have told me why he felt a need to question me, but that was not the case.

    I have also been around long enough to recognize that YOU are a part of the problem and from your responses, I’ll bet you probably get a thrill from rousting people just because you can. As I said before, if you want respect and cooperation from me, stop treating me with suspicion at every turn. It’s really quite simple. I can be a great asset to you, but when you conduct yourself as a mini Gestapo agent at every opportunity, I won’t give you the time of day. If you were to admit that it’s just short-pecker syndrome, I might give you some sympathy.

  • StevenLNew

    See you make judgemants about lying bastard cops but when the shoe is on the other foot, you get mad. lol
    You claim cops are lying bastards, without any facts. at least you haven’t mentioned even one yet.
    1st I have a mother and a father therefore not even a bastard.
    2nd. I take bride in not lying to people I come in contact with.
    Our job is hard because people like you (drunk or not a drunk) feel you don’t have to answer questions by the police or you don’t have to get off the street and walk on the sidewalk. You automatically think all cops are bad, so you stereo type all of us and you get mad when we pull you over. Even if it’s lagit.
    I’ve never said there are no cops who lie… I just plainly stated MOST cops don’t.

  • Alex_nma

    According to the supreme court, see the June 17 2013 ruling of Salinas VS Texas, you do have to make it known you are asserting your right to remain silent in order to have that right. How the supreme court got that wrong is beyond me. But it’s a done deal so you need to be careful. Otherwise, as was done in this case, your silence can and will be used against you.

    “If you haven’t done anything wrong, you don’t have anything to worry about.” is the biggest lie repeat over and over again. If haven’t done anything wrong you should not be bothering me.

  • StevenLNew

    LOL you crack me up!!! Because you are clueless.
    1st I didn’t say when I come in contact with you, I automatically think you are guilty.I said I have to see you as a possible threat. After asking question and hearing your responce that’s when I decide wether or not you are a threat. EVEN after I arrest you, doesn’t mean you are guilty… It mean I have evidence to believe you could be guilty… It’s up to a judge or a panel of your peers to decide if you are actually quilty of whatever it is I arrested you for.

  • StevenLNew

    1st that’s during your trial not when the police come in contact with you. But feel free to advise us of whatever you feel like.
    It’s not a lie… many people actually go to jail for doing absolutey nothing worng?!?!?! Please do tell.
    Not saying it’s never happened, but it would be very rare indeed.

  • Alex_nma

    If you don’t assert your right to remain silent when questioned, then during a trial that can be used against you. Asserting your right has to come before the trial, not during the trial. That’s what happened in this case. Yes, many people do go to jail for doing nothing wrong. Just ask Richard Jewel. He did nothing wrong, and did a lot right, but still ended up being harrased for months. You should visit this site, http://www.innocenceproject.org/ .

  • StevenLNew

    As you know if you followed that case at all. He WAS guilty!!! His attorney try to get that killer off on technicalities.
    It’s attorneys who get criminals off on technicalities that make having more clear laws so even idiots can read and understand them

  • Ernie

    This discussion got started because of your statement that people like me make your job harder. What you seem to be refusing to hear is that it’s COPS who make people like me act the way we do. We feel we don’t have to answer your questions because the United States Constitution SAYS we don’t have to!!! There was a time that I was a good friend of police – both their departments and some individual cops. That was many years ago, before they Gestapo like tactics became commonplace – and treating me as if I’m guilty without any evidence IS a Gestapo like tactic. You are free to continue to act any way that makes you happy, the only point I have been trying to make is that you might get further if you’d lighten up a little. I really don’t care whether you do or not – how much harder do you want your job to be? Maybe you like whining about how hard it is. In the words of Major Payne, “If you’re looking for sympathy, it’s in the dictionary somewhere between shlt and syphilis”.

  • StevenLNew

    I know how the discussion got started and I still agree with what I stated. It’s people like you… Whether you are doing wrong or not doing wrong, don’t think you have to do what the police tells you to do. We don’t tell you to do things that are wrong or against the laws. We ask you to move to the side walks and stay off the steets, because it’s against the law to walk on the streets. People like you get huffy and puffy and say no… I don’t have too.
    We pull you over because you are speeding or swirving, we ask you if you’ve been drinking and you say screw you I don’t have to answer your questions!!!
    The Consitution States you do have to answer my questions or I have the right to take you to jail until we figure out who you are!!!

  • StevenLNew

    I became a police officer to protect and to serve, and I feel I do that on a daily basis.
    The McDonalds ordeal… I’m not sure what happened there, but I do know, when the police tells you to leave… You leave… That reporter kept asking questions after questions… He was asked to leave several times and was told to leave… he was lolly gagging around making excuses, until he got himeslf arrested.
    After the police tell you to do something, whether its right or not… You just do it. If it violated your rights somehow, you take the department and that officer to court and settle it there. That’s how it works.

  • StevenLNew

    I actually don’t dissagree with you on this… I got into trouble once for not writing enough tickets… I told my chief at that time… My job isn’t to write tickets or to take people to jail. If I think someone will understand a warning, then I give a warning. If I pull someone over because he failed to stop at a stop light and he has 10 failures to stop… Obviously a warning isn’t going to help him remember… That’s when I write a ticket.
    Now some of your arguements might be better if not everything out of your mouth was Lying Bastard Cops. It’s obvious you don’t like or respect the police you basically you are hopeless. You will never have respect for the law or police officers no matter how good they are.

  • Ernie

    With every response, you make my point even clearer. You have assumed that I am a drunk driver, you assume that I resist or debate when called out for a violation, you assume that I refuse when a cop says that I need to “move to the side walks” or something similar, you have assumed that I behave disrespectfully when confronted by your bullying behavior, and you continue to justify your Gestapo like tactics. As I said before, you certainly may continue your harassment of innocent people, and many will comply with your heavy handed tactics out of fear. If your desire is merely to gain compliance because you have been given some authority, you might gain some measure of success. On the other hand, if you would begin to exercise the “presumption of innocence”, you will still gain the compliance you desire, while at the same time you would gain a greater measure of respect. (OK – I need to prevent your “high horse” response, I know, so I need to state that when I wrote “your” above, I refer to the larger “your”, meaning cops in general and not you specifically.)

    Please tell me the Article or Amendment of the US Constitution that requires me to answer your questions. Amendments 4 and 5 tell you that I CANNOT be compelled to do so.

    And another fact remains: if I’m in a vehicle on private property, you have no business bothering me, absent a complaint from the owner of the property. If I’m in that same vehicle, on private property, it doesn’t matter if I am “blotto” drunk – you have no business bothering me – so long as I don’t enter a public highway.

    By continuing to justify your Nazi tactics, you prove yourself, like a vast majority of cops, unfit to wear a badge.

    Can you give me a good, sound reason that you shouldn’t assume innocence, in the absence of solid evidence otherwise? Can you give me a good, sound reason for harassing a sleeping driver in a privately owned parking lot – absent a complaint? In an earlier post, you listed a number of theoretical reasons that idiot cop began harassing me when I was endeavoring to get some rest so I could complete my trip safely. Can you give a reason that he shouldn’t tell me the reason for the harassment? Something along the lines of: “We’ve had a complaint from the owner, and you will have to leave the area”, or “A vehicle with a description similar to this was involved in an incident, and I would like to ask you some questions”… Such an approach is diametrically opposite of what I experienced, and will gain much greater compliance. In fact, his unreasonable behavior put the public at risk because I then had to continue my trip, in spite of being very drowsy.

    I think you are absolutely right that not all cops are bad, and maybe you are one of the good ones, but your continued justification of bad behavior makes you sound like one of the worst. (I do think your guess is a bit off – it’s more like 90% bad.) I have never complained about being cited for a violation – on the rare occasion that it happens, I stand on my hind legs and pay my due. What I’m complaining about is that every cop I have come in contact with in the last 25 or so years approaches me with a presumption of guilt. Until I see that start to change, I will comply as much as necessary, but I will NOT do anything to further your Nazi approach. You should think about whether you wish to “Serve and protect” or “Harass and collect”. The choice is yours. I am fully aware of what is required of me, and I will conduct myself as such. I really don’t care whether it makes your job harder – no matter how much you whine. My behavior is a DIRECT reflection of yours – if you would simply stop assuming that I have done something unlawful (or acting as if I have), you will begin to gain a measure of respect and compliance from me. It’s really simple, and the ball is in your court.

  • Alex_nma

    The problem is that is is so difficult to prove the lie. SOME cops know that and work the system to their advantage. If I go to court and I am in front of a judge and it comes down to my word against the cop, the judge will give more credence to the cop than to me. When the system is stacked against the acused, SOME cops will continue to lie.

  • Alex_nma

    As you know we have laws in this country for a reason. The laws are there to protect us all. This law now makes your hard much harder. Because now no one has any reason to speak to the police unless they have legal representation present. There are many innocent people in jail who were doing nothing wrong but ended up in jail because they were trying to be helpful.

  • StevenLNew

    I’m not saying it’s never happened… But it would be rare. You hear these stories from people all the time… MOST of those stories are fabricated by the acused, because no one likes to admit when they are wrong. I know it sounds hard to believe, but it’s true.
    I rarely have people fight my tickets, Why? because I usually give 15 over before I write someone. and usually I will have more on them like no insurance, not using turn signal, or not registered, but I end up writing them for 5 over.
    I usually get the person I’m handing a ticket to, to actually say thank you. (that’s sort of my goal I set)
    Several years ago I had an individual who decided to fight my ticket, when he gets called in from of the Judge to plea inicent, the judge said, ” Ya know, I’ve known this officer for a lot of years, and something tells me, if he wrote you for 70 MPH you were probably actually doing 80 or more MPH.” The kids said, “yes sir.” The judge told him to pay his fine.
    The moral of that story is, I don’t blame the kid for trying, but it was actually disshonest of him to try and acuse me of basically lying.
    Again, I’m not saying it’s never happened, but I would bet 99% of the time, it’s not the police doing the lying.

  • StevenLNew

    We do have laws here for a reason, I completely agree with you… We also have lawyers out there getting quity people off because of technicalities. A guy admits he murdered someone, but the rookie cop forgot to read him his mirranda, so he’s let go. Is that justice?
    I agree there are innocent people in jail, I’m sure there are… But it’s not usualy because the police put them there… It’s because someone else lied to the police and the police had to put them there. For an example, I have a friend who’s dad was accused of messing around with his grand daughter. He went to jail, and during the legal process it came out that the step father was mad at him and nothing actually ever happened. What an awful thing to go through. But it wasn’t the police lying about it, it was someone else, we are just forced to uphold the law and are required to take people to jail wether they are innocent or quitly.
    We don’t decide who is innocent or quilty. The courts do that.

  • StevenLNew

    And sometimes the Justice System get’s it wrong. ( ie OJ Simpson)

  • Alex_nma

    You sound like a reasonable person and I am sure what you say is all true. But in the context of this article where you get pulled over during a traffic stop there is no way for you to know anything about the cop. So you need to be on your guard, much the same way the cop knows nothing about you and is also on his guard. The big difference is that the cop is controlling the situation so you need to be extra careful. Signing off.

  • StevenLNew

    Wow… WAY TOO LONG to reply to all this… But I will answer most of what you wrote. Hopefully you will actually read it.

    1st) I presume these things by what you write. Like how you don’t have to do what the police tells you. Obviously it’s hard to take how people write things vs they way people say things. If we were face to face, I have tone of voice, body language, and attitude to go by, but all I really see when you write over and over again is “Bastard Cops”… I believe that validates most of my presumptions.

    2nd) The police don’t presume innocence or guilt when we 1st come in contact with someone, we let what we called evidence do that. Even then, we don’t take you to jail because you are guilty, we take you to jail because the evidence is showing that you could be guilty of something. We gather as much evidence as we can then we turn it over to the detectives and they actually try to see were the evidence leads… Lot’s of time the evidence ends up proving they are innocent.

    3rd) if I come up to an accident and there is a drunk guy who get’s out of his car and can barely stand because he is so drunk and the little old who was standing on the corner who saw the whole thing, the people in the car that the drunk hit, both saying the drunk ran the red light and hit the car… How do you not assume the drunk is guilty?!?!? BUT!!! All that is evidence… I arrested him on the evidence not because I think he is quilty. EVEN if I think he is guilty.

    4th) Again, I wan’t there when the police officer “harrassed you in a parking lot… But there could be more to the story as I said before. Maybe someone drove by and thought you were dead, (so he could have just been checking up on you to make sure you were ok) maybe the owner of that property has had vandals distroying his property, so maybe he called and askked the police to keep an eye on the property, maybe there had been several crimes in that area lately… Maybe even the cop had a call looking for a car that looked a lot like the car you were in that was invovled in a crime somewhere else. (which happens every night) So he pulled up to see if you could be the suspect. (which goes along with questionings) There could be tons of reasons why he did what he did. I wasn’t there, but all you see was a Bastard Cop harassing you. When that COULD be exactly the opposite of what he was doing. Then again maybe he was too. I just can’t say since I wasn’t there.

    You are OBVIOUSLY bitter to the police. It’s obvious in almost everything you write. You’ve been jaded or you hear so much bad things about the police that you automatically believe everything you hear. 90% of the police officers are good people, there are some bad seeds in every line of work, but you have to admit the police get a bad rap all the time. Take what’s going on in Missouri right now… Most everyone has convicted the Police Officer already. Before the evidence has even come out. I kept saying wait until the evidence, there has to be more to the story… And WALA!!! The truth is finally coming out.

  • StevenLNew

    Thank you, I like to think I am resonable, and I understand what you are trying to say. I just don’t think there is any reason for you or anyone else to be leary about the police pulling you over.
    Cops are supose to control the situation. That’s what we get paid to do. But you should know your rights, I agree with you. but if you didn’t do anything worng you shouldn’t worry.
    I tell my fiends all the time if they get pulled over and they have been drinking… Don’t blow let them take you to jail and get a lawyer, but always be respectful.
    I have let people go for speeding because they were so nice… I’ve had people I would normally let go talk themselves into tickets becasue they were being an @$$.
    Police work isn’t rocket science, if you think it’s wrong it proably is.
    What makes police work hard isn’t are everyday incounters with people… It’s the one in a thousand Jack Hole we hae to deal with from time to time because he doesn’t want to listen to what the policeman is asking them to do. Most departments have an Ask, Tell, Make policy. I usuually Ask, Ask Again, Ask one more time, then tell them, and then make them. My asking usually works for me… Usually
    Stay safe and I’ve enjoyed the debate.
    Steve

  • Ernie

    1) Please show me where I said I don’t have to do what the police tell me to do. I said you MAY NOT compel me to answer questions, or give evidence against myself. BIG difference.

    2) By submitting a person to a series of questions without any evidence of wrongdoing, you give reason to believe you presume a person has done wrong. If you would get the “presumption of innocence” into your brain, and carry it with you all the time, you would probably find your job a whole lot easier, especially when encountering citizens who love freedom and know their rights.

    3) Has absolutely NOTHING to do with any of my positions, hence is irrelevant to this discussion. It looks like you are grasping at straws to support your Police State tactics.

    4) There was no complaint, no report of a suspicious vehicle, no report of a dead body, or if there was, the cop lied to me, which would then support my “lying bastard cop” statement. In the absence of a complaint, my presence there was none of his business, but he could have just as easily run the plate and gone on his way. If he were legitimately concerned for my welfare, he could have simply asked “Are you OK?”, and gone about his business. There was NO good reason for him to subject me to an interrogation as he did. In the absence of a complaint, there was no good reason for him to even give my vehicle a second look.

    Have you found that bit in the Constitution that say I have to answer your questions? You rather conveniently skipped that part. Please – tell me ….

    Also, do you refer to citizens as “civilians”?

    I am only bitter toward cops who appear over-zealous, which in this day is a vast majority of them. Our local police chief is quite the opposite, and I have great respect for him. Interestingly enough, in trying to defend the Gestapo tactics we are often subjected to, you have shown yourself to be a part of the problem. I am nothing but a liberty loving, Constitution defending Army veteran who will NOT willingly submit myself to unreasonable police tactics, but if a majority of cops would simply start acting as if they are there to serve and protect, I’ll be your greatest ally.

    For what it’s worth, I happen to believe (and did from the start) that there’s much more to the story in Ferguson, MO than we currently know. As you, yourself stated earlier regarding citizens, if the cop did nothing wrong, he has nothing to worry about – right?

  • StevenLNew

    1) AND I QUOTE (copied and pasted) “Don’t answer any questions – especially ones like “where are you headed?” or “Have you had anything to drink?”. It’s none of the cop’s business where I’m headed, and you should NOT admit to drinking alcohol, even if you have. That is called a confession. Cops are sneaky, lying bastards and will use whatever deceitful tactic they think will accomplish their goal.” END OF QUOTE

    2) It’s not wrong doing to answer questions if you haven’t done anything wrong. IF you’ve been drinking… I do tell my friends not to tell the police everything, and don’t BLOW in the breathalizer. Let them take you to jail and call a lawyer. But be polite through it all.

    3) It has to do with EVERYTHING you are suggesting. You claim we have to presume innocents at all times!!!

    I’m telling you we don’t presume innocents or guilt… EVEN if we think you are guilty… We go my Evidence and evidence only. We are trainined to leave emossions out of it. It’s not Rocket Science.

    4) I’m not crasping for straws… It sounds like you are BECAUSE NOW you have turned to lies. There is NO possible ways for you to know there were “no report of a suspicious vehicle, no report of a dead body, Only HE would know that… It’s not public access for you to know. Unkess he just flat out said… I’m here to harass you, there are no other reports, I just saw you here and wanted to come over and harass you for no reason.” Which we both know that didn’t happen.

    5) I didn’t skip that part. I thought we covered that already… I never said you had to answer all my questions… ALL I stated was that if you refuse to answer my questions. like who are you? I have the authority to take you in and finger print you until I can find out exactly who you really are. If am called to a scene of a homiced, and you are outside with blood all over you, and I begin asking you question and use refuse to answer them… You are going to jail until I can figure out what’s going on. But if you just got home and you walked in and saw your wife stabbed to death and you tried to save her life, but just couldn’t so you called the police… It would be nice to know that don’t ya think? But if you refuse to tell me… You will go to jail until the evidence prooves you are innocent. Plain and simple.

    6) I’m a Marine vetran and now in the Army, and that has nothing to do with how you treat the police. You are also wrong with stating now a days… Not so long ago, 60’s, 70’s, 80’s and 90’s The police would knock you on your ass for back talking them. My chief back in the 90’s said, if they need thumping, thumo them. ” NOW A DAYS” we don’t do that… ( I never did ) People are sue happy and it’s now cheaper to just pay people off then spend years in court over somehting stupid. Us older police officers always talk about back in the days… We don’t even get into car chaces anymore because of the liabilities it could cause( ie lawsuits) The VAST majority of cops are NOT over zealous.

    There has been complaints about all the military gear we use now, but it’s better to have them and not need them then to not have them and need them. PLEASE WATCH the LA Bank robbery one more time… That is when we started going towards military gear. The Police were out gunned hands down. They actually had to go into gun stores and barrow AR-15’s just to get an upper hand on that situation.

    7) Thank you for your service… And I’m sorry you are jaded, or have had so many bad experiences with law enforcement that it has changed your mind about police officers. I can tell you that being a policeman NOW A DAYS… If you go into a situation and you are not ready… You are DEAD.

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4PSE-EBKPls
    Please Watch

  • StevenLNew

    1) AND I QUOTE (copied and pasted) “Don’t answer any questions – especially ones like “where are you headed?” or “Have you had anything to drink?”. It’s none of the cop’s business where I’m headed, and you should NOT admit to drinking alcohol, even if you have. That is called a confession. Cops are sneaky, lying bastards and will use whatever deceitful tactic they think will accomplish their goal.” END OF QUOTE

    2) It’s not wrong doing to answer questions if you haven’t done anything wrong. IF you’ve been drinking… I do tell my friends not to tell the police everything, and don’t BLOW in the breathalizer. Let them take you to jail and call a lawyer. But be polite through it all.

    3) It has to do with EVERYTHING you are suggesting. You claim we have to presume innocents at all times!!!

    I’m telling you we don’t presume innocents or guilt… EVEN if we think you are guilty… We go my Evidence and evidence only. We are trainined to leave emossions out of it. It’s not Rocket Science.

    4) I’m not crasping for straws… It sounds like you are BECAUSE NOW you have turned to lies. There is NO possible ways for you to know there were “no report of a suspicious vehicle, no report of a dead body, Only HE would know that… It’s not public access for you to know. Unkess he just flat out said… I’m here to harass you, there are no other reports, I just saw you here and wanted to come over and harass you for no reason.” Which we both know that didn’t happen.

    5) I didn’t skip that part. I thought we covered that already… I never said you had to answer all my questions… ALL I stated was that if you refuse to answer my questions. like who are you? I have the authority to take you in and finger print you until I can find out exactly who you really are. If am called to a scene of a homiced, and you are outside with blood all over you, and I begin asking you question and use refuse to answer them… You are going to jail until I can figure out what’s going on. But if you just got home and you walked in and saw your wife stabbed to death and you tried to save her life, but just couldn’t so you called the police… It would be nice to know that don’t ya think? But if you refuse to tell me… You will go to jail until the evidence prooves you are innocent. Plain and simple.

    6) I’m a Marine vetran and now in the Army, and that has nothing to do with how you treat the police. You are also wrong with stating now a days… Not so long ago, 60’s, 70’s, 80’s and 90’s The police would knock you on your ass for back talking them. My chief back in the 90’s said, if they need thumping, thumo them. ” NOW A DAYS” we don’t do that… ( I never did ) People are sue happy and it’s now cheaper to just pay people off then spend years in court over somehting stupid. Us older police officers always talk about back in the days… We don’t even get into car chaces anymore because of the liabilities it could cause( ie lawsuits) The VAST majority of cops are NOT over zealous.

    There has been complaints about all the military gear we use now, but it’s better to have them and not need them then to not have them and need them. PLEASE WATCH the LA Bank robbery one more time… That is when we started going towards military gear. The Police were out gunned hands down. They actually had to go into gun stores and barrow AR-15’s just to get an upper hand on that situation.

    7) Thank you for your service… And I’m sorry you are jaded, or have had so many bad experiences with law enforcement that it has changed your mind about police officers. I can tell you that being a policeman NOW A DAYS… If you go into a situation and you are not ready… You are DEAD
    I emplore you to watch the video on youtube called cop shot for no reason before you respond back.
    Apparently this site won’t let me post it.

  • Ernie

    Remember – this all started because of your butt-hurt whining that “guys like me” make your job harder. That may very well be true, and I will NOT apologize for it – in fact, I hope I DO make your job harder, because you are making my life harder, without good cause. My many attempts to enlighten you as to how you might be part of the cause of that, and suggestions as to how you might change your behavior, and consequently change my view of cops, have obviously fallen on deaf ears. Frankly, I don’t give a sweet shlt whether you or your Gestapo buddies change your ways or not. What I will not do is submit to you jerks just because you think your badge gives you some greater authority than the Law of the Land.

    You failed to show where I said that I don’t have to do what cops tell me to do. In the quote you pasted, I DID state that I will not answer questions, which is a fundamental right protected by the US Constitution. You DID state earlier that the Constitution requires me to answer your questions: “The Consitution States you do have to answer my questions or I have the
    right to take you to jail until we figure out who you are!!!” Yes, copied and pasted. You CAN’T direct me to a passage in the Constitution, because it doesn’t exist, but you sure can make up laws as you go along.

    You are still making my point for me – proving that you are just another lying, low-down, dirt-bag pig of an excuse for a law enforcement officer. Firmly entrenched in your pea-brain is the “might makes right” concept. Make all the excuses you wish, you can fool yourself, but you can’t fool an intelligent, informed citizen. It is YOUR OWN WORDS proving my point.

    BTW, you also didn’t answer my question: Do you refer to citizens as “civilians”. If you truly are military, I need to re-phrase the question: Is it appropriate for cops to refer to citizens as civilians. You have a great knack for dodging questions that seem inconvenient.

    I’ll be happy to give you the last word. Debating you is like playing chess with a pigeon – they knock over all the pieces, shlt all over the board, and then fly back to their buddies proclaiming victory.

    SIEG HEIL!!

  • StevenLNew

    Well Obviously you’re a nut… Because I even copied and pasted what you wrote. I love it when I put you in your place and you have no come back because you get so mad. lolol

    Also my butt doesn’t hurt I get paid the same, it was you stating you don’t have to tell cops anything, it’s none of our buisness. When actually it is our buisness. If your house got broke into and we saw someone walking down the street with a bunch of your stuff… If it was up to you… We couldn’t ask him anything… There for he gets away with all your stuff!!! What a way to go huh? So if that ever happens to you… I hope you remember it guys like you making the job of a police officer harder, AND YOU DON’T CARE. lololol

    If I or every police officer changed our behavior to the way you want us too, the world would be run a muck. There would be people getting shot EVERYWHERE & EVERY DAY!!! and the bad guys would get away with it, because we are not allowed to ask them questions. It’s a good thing you’re not in law enforcement.

    I never once said you have to do exactly what the cops tell you to do. I said you have the right not to talk… It’s even in our miranda rights… DUH!!! But there are consequences when you don’t… You go to jail, until we can figure out what we need to know.
    It’s not rocket science.

    You can call it Gestopa if you like, but obviously you have know clue what the Gestopa was really like.

    Pssst… You can’t enlighten someone when they are right and you are wrong… It just doesn’t work. lolol

    The bottom line is, from what I have said in the beginning, and you just admitted it… It’s guys like you who make our jobs harder. And I know you don’t appolgize for it. Good for you.
    (and you wonder why we make it harder on you, because you won’t cooperate. AGAIN DUH!!!) lololololol

  • Ed

    Dude – if you really are a cop, you shouldn’t be! I read this whole long thing and man, you are whacked! That Ernie dude gave you a bunch of facts, asked some fair questions and you can’t give him a good answer. You accused him saying stuff he never said, you deny saying stuff you did say, and you won’t answer fair questions. No wonder he thinks cops sucks – after reading the crap you wrote, I am ready to join him. You need to quit being a cop, man.

  • StevenLNew

    Whatever… LOL Ernie or whoever you may be… name one question I didn’t answer… name 1 thing I said that I denied saying?
    There was absolutely nothing said here that would make me a bad cop. LOLOLOL
    That’s why I’m guessing this is probably Ernie logging in under another name.

  • Dawson

    Ed are you high? Have you really read any of this. Stevenlnew is the only one making sense. The Ernie guy is a dooshbag for sure. sounds like you are to.

  • StevenLNew

    Thanks Dawson… But obviously Ed isn’t for real. I even stated I’m not one of those guys who is aggressive… I even mentioned I don’t like writing tickets.
    Everything else is just Facts. You have the right not to talk… fact… you will probably go to jail for refusing to talk… fact (police have to know who they are dealing with.
    It is people like Ernie who make it harder for the police to do there work… fact. If you haven’t done anything wrong you have nothing to worry about… fact.
    Through all that I’m now not worthy of being a police officer. LOL

    Ernie and Ed… hmmm they talk just alike… calling police officers cops. More than likely the same person, but who knows. There are a lot of wackos out there.

    People just don’t like being told what to do… I get it… I’m the same way. I got pulled over the last year because my temp tag was dangling… yes it irritated me too, and the 1St thing I said after he walked away (to myself of course) was what an ass, but, I know he was just doing his job. And I’m sure he was looking for an easy ticket too, but through it all I was still polite and answered his few quick questions and I never even mention I was a police officer. I showed him my paper work and insurance card and he said go a head and take it off and just try and fix it when I got home. No big deal at all. Even though I didn’t like being pulled over.

  • mrtwobit

    Ernie, if it was private property, why were you on it? Do you own it? If I had a private parking lot and some guy was parked on it in the middle of the night, I would want my local police to find out what the heck he was doing there. If you’re on my private property, you are a suspect of, at the very least, trespassing.

  • Pondo Sinatra

    Steven, Ernie……hug it out bitches!

  • mrtwobit

    Drinking and Driving is illegal. It’s called Open Container. Having a drink somewhere and then driving is not illegal, per se, but being impaired while driving is and it is up to a police officer to try and determine what is going on if you’re driving in a strange manner. Hence, the questions.

  • StevenLNew

    Here is another tidbit for you… in 2012 there more than 12,000,000 people arrested in the US that’s 34,000 arrest per day. 99.9% were not killed by the police… 400 fatal shootings though… almost all were justified.
    If you don’t believe… look it up yourself Ernie or Ed whoever you are.

  • Vic

    Man, cops are just ass….. . I haven’t had a ticket in 20 years and the other day I was hauling a commercial gym weight set. The country rd speed limit was 50 and this is deep in the country bfe no cars around for 20 mins of driving. I was going 56 cruising with a high load straight rd and got a ticket! I roll down my window and said nicely ” did I do something wrong officer? He said I was going 56 in a 50 zone and I said I haven’t had a ticket in 20 years can you give me a break officer? Also I’m a safe driver you can check my record . We had a friendly conversation but he still gave me a ticket. What a jerk.

  • Strongdoc
  • Strongdoc

    as noted, they were apparently victims of “routine traffic stops”…. ha

  • shatto

    Yeah. How dare he give a ticket to someone who never breaks the law, just because that person was never cited. …. 😉

  • strongdoc

    google the oklahoma traffic cop who just got arrested today for raping at least six women during routine traffic stops…

  • peter watts

    Steven, based on your sentence structure, grammar, and faulty logic, do you have a lot of your cases rejected by the D.A. and tickets thrown out of court?

  • peter watts

    Ernie, you are just a dick. I would guess you have gone through life wondering why it is so hard. It is probably perplexing to you why you have to deal with so many difficult and stupid people. Just keep telling yourself, “It is them and not me.”

  • StevenLNew

    Well there is no faulty logic… at least you didn’t mention any… and I would never send the D.A. a rerport through my cell phone.

    So to answer you meaningless question, no, I have been doing this for 19 years, and I haven’t had one rejected by the D.A. yet. I have had reports sent back to me by my command staff telling me to fix something a time or two, but who hasn’t?

    Please feel free to show the faulty logic.

  • Ernie

    FYI, in this state, parking in a privately owned lot is not trespassing unless there is clear signage indicating so. Even walking on private property is OK, unless signage is present to indicate otherwise. It would become unlawful if the owner, or owner’s agent, asks me to leave and I refuse. I had done NOTHING unlawful, I asked the cop, specifically, “Have you had a complaint about my being here?”, and he replied that he had NOT had a complaint. I also asked whether there was a BOL for a vehicle similar to mine, and again, the answer was “No”, and that he saw my vehicle and was “curious”. My point is that “curious” is NOT sufficient reason to impose upon my liberty – absent a complaint. That is a tactic used by repressive governments (think Gestapo, KGB, etc.) to intimidate and instill fear, and is entirely inappropriate in the USA. If the cop had said there was a complaint, I would have willingly left the area. Had he said there was a BOL for a vehicle like mine, I would have helped him determine that I was NOT the person he was looking for. His “fishing” expedition, though, because he was “curious” was offensive and completely uncalled for. There is NO legitimate reason for it!! After all, what do people in authority suggest a driver do when drowsy? What that idiot did actually endangered the driving public, as I no longer believed I could take a much needed nap without being rousted by some jack-wagon cop.

    If you have followed this conversation, you might notice that I have never advocated being rude to a cop, nor have I advocated any unlawful act. I have done neither, and as I stated, on the rare occasion that a cop catches me (I say rare because I’ve had only about 2 moving violations in nearly 45 years of driving), I stand on my hind legs and pay my due. If a cop asks me questions that are legitimate, I will answer, but when they are merely “fishing”, they can expect silence from me. Something along these lines: “Since the United States Constitution guarantees that I cannot be compelled to give evidence against myself, I will decline the opportunity to answer your questions. Am I free to go?” Most cops don’t like it much, but I don’t like their restricting my freedom without cause, so that makes us even.

  • Madeline Grace

    Where do these people come from? Sounds like Mr. Watts could be Ernie to

  • Madeline Grace

    What does logic have to do with what you’ve said or police work?

  • StevenLNew

    AT LEAST READ THE ENTIRE POST BEFORE YOU COMMENT. LOLOL

    There is some logic involved in poice work… If I get called for a shop lifter at the local mall, they show me a clear video of the suspect putting clothes under their shirt and walking out the door, It’s logical , that this person was stealing from the store.

    Using logic, I’m guessing these 3 guys are far left wing democrats. Who will probably come back and tell me no, they are independent, but who knows, I could be wrong.

    As far as what I’ve written so far, logic has nothing to do with it. I’ve only stated facts, that anyone can look up themselves.

    There are also 314 million residence in the US and only 245 police officers per 100,000… As I stated before there are 12 million arrests a year. that’s 34,000 arrests per day… 400 fatal police involved shottings per year, and most all were justified. That’s less than 1% who encounter police actually die. So 99.9 % who encounter the police actually live to see another day.
    OVER 58,000 officers are assaulted each year on duty. There were also 75 police officer killed in the line of duty last year alone. (FBI STATS LOOK THEM UP YOURSELF)

    And they want us to be nicer as police officers. lol

    As I’ve said before, I’ve been considered a “nice cop” believe it or not, I actually got in trouble for it a few years ago. I was told paying for a guy who drove off without paying for his gas was not part of the job… Yet Peter will say I’m not fit to be a police officer.
    Yes I could have ran his tag and went after him, and thrown him in jail for it, but I thought he probably really needed his money worse then I did. He had 3 kids in the car with him. He may of actually just forgot to pay… Kids will do that to you, but I didn’t feel dragging him out of his home with kids was the right thing to do. ( and yes I got in trouble over it )

  • roy

    par for the course. there’s a reason people have started calling people like him “the hand of the oppressor”. btw, if 90% aren’t bad, then why don’t they do something about that only 10% bad?

  • roy

    he makes sense to other cops.

  • roy

    of course the police say they were justified. no one doubts the hand of the oppressor will support their own.

  • roy

    most people call “police officers” “cops”. you only care about the difference because you want respect and you can’t see that there’s a reason why the term “cop” came about.

  • roy

    no, because his job is to find future convicts. the DA loves him because it gives the DA a chance to put someone else behind bars.

  • roy

    you’ve shown the fault yourself. the constitutions of the states and federal governments were written from the perspective of protecting people from the government, but you’ve interpreted them as the opposite. the rest of your arguments have been analogous.

  • roy

    it’s a good thing we’ve got people like you to make sure the entire population of the country gets arrested and imprisoned within 26 years, isn’t it?

  • roy

    all “police officers” lie. it’s part of the job description. the supreme court said it’s OK for cops to commit purgery, but not OK for people to lie to cops while not under oath. show me an honest cop and i’ll show you a real live unicorn.

  • roy

    he’ll sound reasonable when he needs to.

  • roy

    no, you ask where someone’s headng because you’re fishing for guilt. you’re trying to get someone to admit to doing wrong, and you’ll twist their words when necessary to get them convicted.

  • roy

    better yet, why is parking on public property considered trespassing? if it’s public, how can ANYONE trespass?

  • roy

    now you’re talking like a cop.

  • roy

    every cop is out to get anyone they can.

  • roy

    cops don’t care if a “subject” is guilty. they care to make them look guilty. and they think everyone is their subject instead of a citizen.

  • roy

    actually, the right to remain silent doesn’t exist. the right to not incriminate oneself if what you’re trying to refer to in a backhanded way. but you don’t really understand that because you think rights are an artificial construct that gets in the way of you “doing your job.”

  • roy

    alex may have chosen a case that you think went the right way, but the truth of the matter is that that interpretation of the right to not incriminate oneself came from the practice of creating more and more laws which were direct violations of rights. there had to be a way of defeating the rights of the citizen. the right isn’t to remain silent as the courts have ruled, but is specifically to protect people from you and yoru masters because you’ll look for any excuse to put someone behind bars. the assertion of the right to not incriminate oneself came from the british doing what our government is doing now. let me clarify: the right didn’t come from it, only the need to clarify to the government that it wasn’t allowed to force someone to admit to violating a law that violates a person’s rights made that right worth writing down. the constitution of the federal and state governments were written from the perspective of protecting the people from the government, but you’re asserting it’s the opposite. have you ever tried reading them?

  • StevenLNew

    When did I dissagree with the Constitution? I’ve agreed with everyone so far. I don’t interpret it either… I follow it.
    So obviously you don’t actually read these posts.

  • StevenLNew

    And obviously you hate giving respect to officers.
    I don’t care what anyone calls me… As long as you don’t call me late for lunch….
    I usually refer to myself as the po po.

  • StevenLNew

    AND AGAIN OBVIOUSLY
    you don’t actually read these posts. Or you would have seen were I’ve actually kept people from going to jail.

  • StevenLNew

    Please so me where it says that Ernie… Or Ed… Or Roy… Whoever you are… lololol
    My father was honest, I’m honest… Now show me a unicorn!!! lol

  • StevenLNew

    See that’s were you are wrong. Last time I asked someone where they were heading… They were actually heading the other way. So apparently they were lying to me. This starts off the bad experience with the po po… All I ask is be honest with me.

  • StevenLNew

    And that’s bad why?

  • StevenLNew

    AGAIN Read Posts before posting.
    That’s why I actually got in trouble for paying for a families gas after they drove off without paying… Because I wanted them to go to jail?!?!? That makes no sense at all.
    Keep fishing Roy

  • StevenLNew

    Again Obviously you don’t read posts.
    So your comments are worthless.

  • StevenLNew

    Actually it is the right to remain silent.
    More hatered from Roy. lolololol

  • StevenLNew

    AGAIN OBVIOUSLY you don’t actually read post… You just like to spew words into the air.
    I don’t dissagree with you about the right to remain silent. Never have… But you claim I say just the oposite.
    Please show me… or copy and paste where I’ve stated the opposite?
    You can’t because it hasn’t happened.

  • Madeline Grace

    You’re a complete moron Roy! Go crawl back under the rock you came out from under.

  • roy

    right…and then you expected people to believe you.

  • roy

    among other things: you said the constitution gives you the right to arrest people if they don’t answer your questions.

  • roy

    i did. steven’s a good example.

  • roy

    and they could have just been lost. but you interpret it as they must be guilty of something. then you proceed to lay down a trap of words. you make them an offender for what they say.

  • roy

    maybe you should start thinking about it. your MO is to talk down to everyone. but hey, you wouldn’t understand, you’re a cop.

  • roy

    i’m not fishing. i’m just setting straight what you’re lying about.

  • roy

    i read them. you just show by your attitude that you don’t believe what you say. you say what’s convenient and then contradict it in the same post.

  • roy

    if you would read the constitution, you’d read, these words: “nor shall be compelled in any criminal case to be a witness against himself, nor be deprived of life, liberty, or property, without due process of law” where does it say “remain silent?” to you, due process is someone not answering your guilt fishing questions.

  • roy

    it’s ok. you just have stockholm syndrome. you think he’s protecting you. sorry to be the bearer of bad news.

  • roy

    yes you do. you think it’s “the right to remain silent” but it’s only interpreted that way now because of judicial precedence, but the constitution states otherwise. but you also think them invoking that right gives you the right to arrest them. complete contradiction. i don’t have to copy and paste. you said yourself that if someone doesn’t answer you questions that you have the right to arrest them. go read your own posts that you typed with your own hands.

  • roy

    again, your example is not convicting someone. more often the problem is that people are convicted wrongly or for violating a law that is a violation of their rights to begin with.

  • roy

    all you see is criminals.

  • roy

    agreed, just like exercising any other right. if you don’t submit to a violation of your privacy, you are assumed guilty.

  • roy

    you sound like a typical cop

  • William

    You sound like the typical drunk who only had two drinks. LOL!

  • roy

    i lied to the police a few times. i told them i violated some random law or did something else that was similarly immoral, and until i told the lie, they wouldn’t believe i wasn’t doing anything wrong. if you want to get away with being a good person, you have to lie to the police and tell them you’re being a bad person. after you lie and falsely admit to doing something wrong, they’ll leave you alone with only a fine to pay instead of dragging you to jail.

  • roy

    you certainly sound like a cop. and since lying is one of their most common traits, you should expect people to not believe this last post.

  • roy

    “your average police officer” most certainly does lie. constantly.

  • William

    …and those who are pulled over and given a ticket knowing full well they are guilty, but profess their innocence anyway are honest by your definition of honesty?

  • roy

    again, you assume someone is guilty…you just have to find out what they are guilty of.

  • roy

    when the “justice system” turns everything into a money making scheme, i actually don’t have a problem with people trying to get out of it any way possible, but i wouldn’t consider any form of lying honest. that’s something the courts do with police officers. and you seem to support such things. you just did a great job of putting words into my mouth that i never would have said. again, you are acting just like a cop.

  • roy

    why is it illegal to have an open container of a legal substance? this is a law violating peoples’ rights. start actually thinking. having an open container of a legal substance is against the law…think about the insanity you’re supporting. just read your own words, consider the ultimate consequences for society, and stop fighting against yourself. you don’t make more laws to take away more freedom from people and expect it to turn out good in the end. you enforce rights and contracts and stop trying to control people.

  • William

    You were questioning my honesty I believe. I have been pulled over numerous times since I began driving back in 1968 and only once was the cop in the wrong. We straightened that out right then though. He was young and new to the job and he admitted he could have been mistaken. I have also been let go on many occasions simply because I was honest enough with the cop to admit my guilt. So if you choose to call me a cop simply because I choose to be honest when my errors in driving are brought to my attention by a cop doing their job then whatever makes you happy. If you are a young man I know that your generation prides itself more on being able to lie your way out of any situation rather than just being up front about it when you are caught. I guess that would go back to how you were or were not raised, but taking pride in your lies vs taking pride in your honesty frankly makes no sense.

  • roy

    a subject is just that…someone controlled by a totalitarian. a citizen is sovereign and rules himself. we need people to stop relying on the government to tell them not to do bad things and for people to actually start taking responsibility for themselves. reading this is comforting, but i know people like you are rare, so the comfort doesn’t last so long.

  • roy

    an opinion supported by facts

  • roy

    eh…democracy is the worst form of tyranny anyway. instead of being upholders of rights, it turns the few (maybe 1/10 of a percent) good cops into mob enforcers.

  • roy

    your friendly neighborhood mob enforcers

  • roy

    unfortunately, they do tend to protect them from ALL laws.

  • William

    You can say everything in government is a money making scheme. but please explain how if you know you were caught speeding 65 in a 40 zone just for an example and you know you were speeding how would you consider that a money making scheme at that point since you know you are guilty. The cop didn’t break the law you did.

  • roy

    still waiting

  • StevenLNew

    It’s funny you say things like that but it just goes in one ear and out the other to those reading this, because I’ve asked you to show me were I have lied or said something contradicting but you failed to do so of course… Because there isn’t any… I will let you try again.
    I will type this slow and loud so you can read it better.
    SHOW ME PROOF THAT I DID CONTRADICT ANYTHING!!!

  • StevenLNew

    SHOW ME WERE I LIED ABOUT ANYTHING… IF I DID IT WILL BE ON HERE… BUT YOU DON’T BECAUSE YOU CAN’T

  • StevenLNew

    WELL NUMB NUTS!!!

    if you would have read the posts like you claim you do… You would seen we were talking about the Miranda Rights then!!!

    Please Read before opening mouth and inserting foot. lolol

  • roy

    “a lot of drivers are sneaky, lying bastards and will use whatever deceitful tactic…” that’s why i said you sound like a typical cop. dishonesty goes along with being a cop, as does assumption of guilt by everyone. i don’t have any pride. that includes my honesty. every time i’ve lied to a cop to justify them thinking i was doing something wrong and thereby got out of the worse thing they accused me of, i’ve felt an enormous amount of guilt about it, but there was also a bit of comfort that i didn’t get the worse punishment for the other thing i also didn’t do. if you want to turn this into a discussion of the fallibility of my generation (or i assume you mean the generations that came after mine) i’d have to agree on the despicable nature of the societal decay we’re experiencing here in the united states of america. but, assuming guilt and making more laws and treating the average person like a criminal isn’t going to solve the problem. people need to start taking responsibility for themselves again. this police state we’re living in won’t solve it. it only makes people rely on the government for the basics of right and wrong. putting that in the hand of the government always leads to the worst imaginable outcome.

  • StevenLNew

    Taking the 5th which is what you keep refering too, when you keep quoting the constitution is done in the court of law… Key Word… COURT. (Criminal Case as the constitution refers it to)

    The Right to remain Silent is done on scene, when I come in contact with you… I still have the right to arrest you… Do you really think if you don’t speak to the police officer you have the right to go free?
    REALLY that’s what you think? Surely not.

  • StevenLNew

    I’m not too sure we even disagree with each other, but maybe on not on the same page…
    Let me ask you this… If you Rob a bank… And I stop you as a police officer… Are you saying that if you invoke the 5th, I can not arrest you?

  • roy

    i don’t really know where to start with you. but maybe this will be good enough: we used to believe in popular sovereignty. now we, as a nation, don’t seem to know if we believe in national sovereignty or the sovereignty of some disconnected, self-serving group of aliens who have no idea where our founding philosophy came from or why it worked so well for over 200 years. when will it end? where will it end? will people ever want their freedom back? do we really need some other person to tell us how to live our lives? if so, why is it that we’ll trust another person instead of ourselves? isn’t that person still just another person? can’t we trust our own judgement? if you think those questions through, and you actually do believe in rights and freedom, your perspective will eventually change so that you don’t even care to have this artificial construct of yours answered.

  • StevenLNew

    I’m not sure what your point is… But if you came up to me and told me you just brokr the law… I would say… OK becareful not to do it again. If you told me you murdered someone and you wanted to turn yourself in, I would take you in. It wouldn’t be the 1st time that happened. (not to me)

    What’s your point?

    To me it doesn’t matter what you tell me… It’s about evidence. If you tell me you murdered someone, I will take you for your word… If you tell me you just ran a red light… I’m going to tell you, I didn’t see it so you are good to go.

  • StevenLNew

    You are wrong… You just don’t like the police… And again, I’m not saying NO cops lie… I’m stating the majority do not.

  • StevenLNew

    I’ve told you… My Father and myself.

    Let me give you an example of my father. One of the Best Cops I have ever known. A GREAT Christian man as well. (not that you care about that)

    My dad did K-9 for 20 years… He has gone into many houses with drugs and money… My dad has turn in hundreds of thousands of drug money… EVERY CENT. My dad has earned several awards for his good work… For risking his own life to save others. Running into a burning house to save a ladies life.

    So when you claim ALL cops lie… You are obviously JADED against the police… It’s not hard to see.

    If you said cops lie all the time… I wouldn’t even dissagree with you. But you generalize it by saying ALL Cops lie… Which is obviously not true. The majority don’t

  • roy

    the proof is on your own posts. the proof is the assumption of guilt plainly manifest in your writing while saying you presume innocence. the proof is saying you follow the constitution when your arguments for such show you haven’t read it. the proof is saying you believe in the right to remain silent (even though the canonized right is not to remain silent, but rather to not be forced to incriminate oneself) while saying that if someone doesn’t answer your questions that it gives you the right to throw them in jail. the proof is actual contradictions. how can you not see that your contradictions are the proof of your contradictions?! do all cops actually think they’re telling the truth when they’re lying? it would explain a lot. maybe you guys aren’t dishonest on purpose, eh? maybe you’re all just crazy and need some serious therapy?

  • StevenLNew

    AGAIN DUE TO YOUR LACK OF READING!!!

    I’ve said it several times… I don’t assume anything… I go by evidence… If there is enough evidence to take you to jail, then I do… wether you speak to me or not. I DO NOT decide who is guilty or NOT guilty. That’s for the courts and a jury of your peers to decide.

    Where do you come up with this stuff? Please read more carefully.

  • William

    Roy you are out there on the fringe. By your logic there should be no traffic laws, no DWI laws and just let everyone figure it out for themselves. That used to be called anarchy. What world or dimension do you live in?

  • roy

    ah…name calling. i guess i DID call you a “cop”, but honestly, i think even that’s being too nice to you. (although, you probably take such references as compliments anyway) miranda rights as a group don’t exist outside of judicial precedence. you and the rest here don’t seem to get that. the right to remain silent does exist, and i was wrong to say it doesn’t, but i was trying to redirect the insanty here away from the artificial constructs that people like you are fond of creating and using. really the right to remain silent is just a way of exercising the right to not incriminate oneself. miranda rights and the stupidity of needing to be read them is typical of the “justice system.” it only came from cops not respecting peoples’ rights to begin with combined with ignorance of the populace about rights. it’s really just a warning that the cops will do everything they can to put you behind bars. and where did you get that this was about miranda rights? it’s about the article and how it says the abusive methods you and the rest of your thug buddies use are supposedly ok and how we should placate you. it’s about how the article is showing the attitude of totalitarianism of the police force and how it is missing the point that the problem is with the police who think everyone is their subject. maybe YOU should read the posts before chewing on toe jam.

  • roy

    and just remember that you’re not allowed to defend yourself against a police officer

  • StevenLNew

    AGAIN… You claim you read posts, but then you go and post something like this… Which again makes no sense if you read all the posts.

    Let me spell it out for you slowly AGAIN!!!

    I HAVE SAID TIME AND TIME AGAIN… YOU DO (That’s a do) HAVE THE RIGHT TO REMAIN SILENT!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
    It’s in our Miranda!!!

    I’m not sure why you keep saying I said you don’t?!?!?!?!

  • roy

    how about you actually show how i didn’t prove your contradictions now? and just so you know, arresting someone for not answering your questions is depriving them of their right to liberty without due process. your presumption of guilt is not due process. how can you not see this? by your own words before, it’s the fact that someone doesn’t answer your questions? and that’s not assumption of guilt?! it must really be insanity.

  • roy

    i didn’t say you said that people don’t have the right to remain silent. i said the right is to not incriminate onself. and you don’t accept that as an actual right, nor do you actually accept the “right to remain silent” because if someone refuses to answer your questions, you will by your own words deprive them of the right to liberty because of your own assumption of guilt. read your own words.

  • StevenLNew

    So… AGAIN I ask you… Seeings you avoided answering this question.

    If you robbed a bank ran out the front door and I there I stand… I detain you read you your miranda right and ask you questions, that of course you refuse to answer, because you chose to remain silent…

    ARE YOU SAYING I NOW HAVE TO LET YOU GO?!?!

  • roy

    that quote from the constitution says exactly that. if you have not followed due process, you can’t deprive anyone of their rights. plain and simple. you think due process is your whim. it’s not. you don’t have the right to arrest anyone on your whim. you have to get a warrant. that has to be issued by actual evidence. read the actual words in the constitution.

  • StevenLNew

    Maybe this can shed some light…

    Definition of Tenth Amendment

    The fundamental right of a government to make all necessary laws. In the United States, state police power comes from the Tenth Amendment to the Constitution, which gives states the rights and powers “not delegated to the United States.” States are thus granted the power to establish and enforce laws protecting the welfare, safety, and health of the public.

    It’s kind of like in some states you can’t have a gun, but the constitution says you have the right to bare arms… Lets see you go bare arms in New York, and see how they treat you.

  • roy

    first of all, i’m not like you. i wouldn’t rob a bank. or other citizens for that matter. second, did someone see you rob the bank? did a warrant for arrest get issued based on the evidence? if not, then you shouldn’t be arrested. how would anyone know you robbed that bank unless there was evidence? did you really rob that bank? (not that i’d put it past you personally) but then again, i’m not like a cop in that i’d rob a bank or deprive you of your rights for the thought that you may have done it.

  • roy

    just read your own posts.

  • StevenLNew

    Why would I need to prove that… I’m not claiming anything… You said I contraticted myself without proof, because I didn’t that’s why you have no proof and why you refuse to show proof.
    You like to try and twist things to make it sound like you are right, and I’m not even saying you are wrong except when you state ALL cops lie, and that I contraticted myself, or that I ask questions to try get you.
    If you only KNEW how many people I’ve let go over small amounts of pot, or speeding… MY JOB IS NOT TO ARREST OR TO TAKE PEOPLE TO JAIL… MY JOB IS TO KEEP MY CITY AND OR COUNTY SAFE.
    THAT’S IT

  • roy

    ok, so New York is great at violating the rights of the citizens, big surprise, eh? and you misread that part of the constitution too. the constitution is saying that the people are sovereign and the government is subserviant. that actual text is: “The powers not delegated to the United States by the Constitution, nor prohibited by it to the States, are reserved to the States respectively, or to the people.” that doesn’t mean that states can make laws that violate rights, but then again, the 9th amendment isn’t something that bullies like yourself are terribly fond of.

  • roy

    based on your attitude, i don’t believe you.

  • StevenLNew

    I did read my own words… And I never contradicted myself once.
    You know as well as I do… If you knew where I did contradicted myself you would post it in a heart beat…
    I just think you missread something I wrote, or took it the wrong way, or thought I was talking about one thing when I was talking about another… Like with the Miranda vs Pleading the 5th

  • roy

    like i said before, i wouldn’t rob a bank like you would. and that wasn’t your question. you didn’t say you were standing there and witnessing yourself rob the bank. but honestly, i don’t see you arresting yourself for one of your crimes.

  • roy

    your perspective shows you don’t understand. you want more government telling you how to live your life. i want a small government letting me life my life as i see fit.

  • roy

    and i DID prove you contradicted yourself.

  • StevenLNew

    I don’t know why… Like I’ve said… I’ve even got in to trouble for paying for a guy fuel when he drove off with out paying. I paid $35 out of my own pocket so this guy would not go to jail. I could have easily of taken him to jail… But I knew he was desperate and needed gas.

    I know… I know… I’m a big jerk!!! BAD COP!!!! lolol

  • StevenLNew

    That is exactly what I said…

    Now you are claiming COPS rob banks?!?!?!? What’s next?!?!?

  • William

    So if you choose to drive drunk and and hit my child and kill them, then I should just say oh well you had that right. If that’s the case I should then have the right to kill you right on the spot. I think that would be fair don’t you?

  • StevenLNew

    No you didn’t!!! Not once… lol

    I ‘ve asked you to several times, but you refuse too…
    You EVEN JUST WROTE… Why don’t you prove you didn’t contradict youself instead.

  • StevenLNew

    I kow… I am a big bully.
    After I paid $35 out of my own pocket so this guy would not go to jail. I could have easily of taken him to jail… But I knew he was desperate and needed gas.

    I know… I know… I’m a big jerk!!! BAD COP!!!! lolol
    I will say New York isn’t known for their niceness.

  • roy

    no, you did NOT say you witnessed the crime. you said someone didn’t answer your questions. proof that you lied…but to be honest, to prove the case would require date stamps. you were also suggesting that i’d rob a bank. i wouldn’t. based on how you think you’re above the law because of that bright, shiny badge, i wouldn’t be surprised if you robbed a bank.

  • roy

    one good deed doesn’t mean much…and since it’s coming from a cop who has lied multiple times even here on his posts, i don’t really believe you did that.

    and yes, new york is full of bullies. cops are the only ones allowed to own implements of self defense there…and now we see why there are so many murders in new york. more rights deprived equals more crimes committed.

    and everyone in the area you live gets to pay you to brutalize them. that $35 came from the people you are ordered to violate the rights of.

  • StevenLNew

    It’s funny how the only thing you are left with is I wouldn’t rob a bank like you!!! LOLOLOLOLOLOLOLOLOLOLOLOLOLOLOLOLOLOL

    How old are you? (oops that’s a question you don’t have to answer)

    This is why your arguemnets are worthless… You don’t deal in facts.
    You deal in juvinile insults and accusations, and I deal in facts.

  • roy

    i did, go step by step through my proof and show my proof to be wrong. do it. you’ll keep looking more and more dishonest.

  • roy

    speaking of juvenile insults and accusations…you were suggesting i would rob a bank…after calling me “numb nuts” who doesn’t deal in facts?

  • StevenLNew

    lololol

    You went from so so inteligent arguements to this…
    You’ve never proven I lied or contradicted myself.
    But now you act like a 6 year old, and assume I’m a bad cop.

    It’s funny… When people get put in their place… That’s what they end up doing.

  • roy

    you don’t really know what rights are, do you? if someone kills someone else, they have violated that person’s right to life and should be dealt with accordingly. you think more laws and more beaurocracy can eliminate such problems. you’re wrong. if less people would think in such a ridiculous way, we’d actually have more people taking responsibility for their actions instead of having to make up a new law every time someone violates someone else’s rights. you can’t make that many laws. you don’t even know you’re crazy.

  • StevenLNew

    OMGOODNESS!!!

    REALLY?!?!?!?

    I never claimed you rob banks… NEVER!!! NOT ONCE!!!

    It was a HYPOTHETICAL question.

    I said IF you robbed a bank.

    Which you never had an answer to. either…

    I will say I did call you NUM NUTS… That’s a military thing that we say to people who just don’t get it.

  • roy

    the assumption’s not based on anything but your own comments. i DID prove your contradictions, i just didn’t copy and paste some text. i guess i AM acting like a 6-yr-old because i’m arguing on the internet with the hand of the oppressor.

  • StevenLNew

    OMGOODNESS!!!

    REALLY?!?!?!?

    I never claimed you rob banks… NEVER!!! NOT ONCE!!!

    It was a HYPOTHETICAL question.

    I said IF you robbed a bank.

    Which you never had an answer to. either…

    I will say I did call you NUM NUTS… That’s a military thing that we say to people who just don’t get it.

  • roy

    you referred to me in the second person. you said “you” as in me. you suggested i would have done so.

  • StevenLNew

    OH that’s too funny!!!
    You have never copied or pasted anything as of yet. You just go straight to insults and acusations. BECAUSE YOU HAVE BEEN PROVEN WRONG WAY TOO MANY TIMES!!!!!! lololol
    Too Funny!!!!

  • William

    I see you really do live in alternate universe don’t you. Maybe if you got off the crack for a while your brain would start to function again. Miracles do happen.

  • StevenLNew

    I asked you… If you were to rob a bank, ran outside into me and I took you into custody byt you refused to answer my question… Do you feel I would have to let you go?
    That wa a hypathetical question… Because you stated if people remained silent I could not arrest them.

  • roy

    i just said that i didn’t copy and paste. i did refer to your posts. you can go read your own posts to see it for yourself if you don’t remember what you typed.

  • roy

    no, you said if i robbed a bank and you stopped me. you didn’t say you witnessed the robbery. you didn’t say you stopped me outside the bank with bags of money and a mask running out really fast and running into you until AFTER i answered you. i understand that it’s a hypothetical question, but you keep making up new details of this hypothetical situation which i knew you would, because you’re a cop, and you’re saying that i would hypothetically be the person committing the crime. i wouldn’t be.

  • StevenLNew

    You refer to calling names and claiming I would rob bank and I’m an oppressor… You words don’t hold any value. You’ve made to many accusations and lies… Why would anyone believe your words.
    AGAIN I DEAL IN FACTS!!!
    Please copy and paste if I’ve said something that was wrong.
    You won’t because you can’t… I haven’t done so that why!!! lolol

  • StevenLNew

    EXACTLY…. READ WHAT YOU JUST WROTE!!!
    KEY WORD…. IF!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

  • roy

    how do you know he didn’t have permission?

  • F.U.

    if the cop doesn’t like what I’m doing in MY car…then just shoot me, fucker

  • roy

    i don’t deal in facts? i clearly proved everything you said i didn’t by referring to your own posts. i didn’t copy and paste, but i guess the assumption that i was dealing with an honest, intelligent human being is too engrained into my personality to completely put it away, even when i’m talking to a cop. maybe i should copy and paste your own words? i think i’m done. i think you’re right in that i’m acting like a 6-yr-old by arguing with the hand of the oppressor on the internet.

  • roy

    he will. it’s his way of saying he cares.

  • mindbender1946

    Don’t pay the ticket.

    Insist on a hearing. If the radar/laser equipment wasn’t calibrated in the required time frame, it cannot be considered as accurate and the ticket will be tossed out.

    ALSO: If the officer is unable to show up for the hearing he cannot argue the case and the ticket will be tossed.

    ANOTHER point: Most auto manufacturers allow the speedo to be accurate to +- 3 Miles per hour at 60. I know this because I worked at an auto assembly plant. You might plead that as a factor but depending on your insurance and your pocket book, I would suggest a lawyer to plead your case. Some insurance companies will use the ticket as an excuse to raise your insurance rate. The lawyer might be cheaper than a rate hike which can last five years.

  • StevenLNew

    LOLOL
    Obviously you are having a conversation with someone else… I have asked you several times to provide proof of your claim to know avail. Not once have you proven a point at all. You have made accusations, and assumptions which you obviously can’t prove… all you say is I did prove it… when everyone who maybe reading this knows you haven’t.
    You just keep living in your delusional world were facts are not proof. LOL

  • StevenLNew

    Maybe you should copy and paste… I’ve only asked you to do that a dozen times.

    You are obviously delusional if you are still using words like oppressor over getting pulled over by the police.

  • StevenLNew

    You even claimed I called you a bank robber, which was a lie… you did copy and paste what I wrote which even after you did that you still thought I called you a bank robber, even you copied and pasted what I wrote you failed to see the word IF you robbed a bank.
    And all that was brought up because You claimed the police can’t arrest you if you just don’t talk. Which is obviously laughable. You keep believing what you will.

  • Sonya InTexas

    I never understood why, after running my license plate, and verifying my drivers license and insurance, does a cop come back to my car..look at me and STILL asks me if it’s my car I’m driving. I once asked well does the picture on the license look like me and match all of the other documents I gave you? “Yes”, says the officer. I say, “Well why are you asking if this car is mine?” Sheesh, it’s like they can’t put two and two together.

  • strongdoc

    i know right? very comforting to know that you LOSE either way. scary sh@t. people wonder why cops make people, law-abiding or not (i’ve had one ticket in my 42 years of life), nervous as hell.

    just google the video of that a-hole cop beating the crap out of the lady on the side of the california highway recently. seriously? that PROVES without ANY reasonable doubt that that particular cop has a G.O.D. complex. who else would have the big brass balls to beat someone like that, in full view of other “citizens” without nary a care that someone would be watching and that maybe he should chill out???? dude was above it ALL.

    generally speaking, you have someone with a license to do whatever, whenever, to whomever and the onus is on the “citizen” to prove they didn’t deserve whatever they got.

    to make matters worse, thinking folks must realize that running across a bad apple cop could happen to ANYONE at ANYTIME. i.e., those raped women or any other random person minding their own business, or EVEN being pulled over for a violation, prior to being molested by a rogue cop.

    most cops seem to be cool, in general, but it’s the a-holes that are SCARY.

  • strongdoc

    to all the cops out there, why is it that a “citizen” is required to let someone literally BEAT them like that without the ability to fight back or DEFEND themselves from possible permanent disability or death?

    i just try to avoid cops at all costs.

  • strongdoc

    it seems that steven is a good guy and isn’t out to bust people’s balls. BUT, there are many many many cops who love the power trip that comes with the badge and the sh#t rolls down hill to the “citizens”. i’ve gone to school with them, i’ve been in fraternities with them, i know several of them today. if steven is denying that, i think that he is being very disingenuous.

    not only that, regardless of the reason why, sometimes it annoying as hell to have someone ask you, as a grown adult, why you are going where you are going. is there a curfew?

    two years ago i was leaving the hospital at around 2am. i’m wearing scrubs, etc. i drive across the street to a 24′ fedex office to make copies. the parking lot is EMPTY except for my car and a cop car with cop inside the car. parking lot is EMPTY.

    i walk inside, make my copies, and leave. still in my hospital scrubs.

    i get in car, leave, cop….OF COURSE…follows me. i pull out of the parking lot, the lights flash. i pull over. cop walks up and says, and i QUOTE….verbatim…

    “what are you doing out so late?”

    WTF am i doing out so late????????????????????

    WHY WAS I OUT SO LATE???????????????

    ha ha ha ha…. i lost it…

    I did cuss, and i did ask him was there an “effin” curfew that i didn’t know about it?? he replied that i didn’t have to use that language or address him in that manner. i replied that as an adult male that i didn’t feel the need to have to EXPLAIN TO MY DADDY COP why i was out. AT ALL.

    he then asked me, do i work at the hospital, seeing as the hospital was 100 ft away, and me in scrubs must have been a dead giveaway, i figured why lie (sarcasm). i said yes. he took my info, and told me to be more polite and have a good night (ok dad). i drove off without saying a word.

    that, steven, is the type of crap that many people have to deal with and is why people can be quite irked at pain in ass cops like that guy.

    leaving a COPY shop and some dipshit asks me…

    “WHAT ARE YOU DOING OUT SO LATE?”

    are you kidding me????

  • StevenLNew

    Well thank you… I’ve said from the beginning… I know not all cops are good, but they just kept saying all cops are liers and just looking for reasons to put people in jail. I just don’t believe it. I know some that get a thrill out of arresting people, but they wouldn’t lie to do it. I have known some that would too, but the majority would not. IMO

    I had a friend who arrested a guy who was sleeping in his car at the bar because it was cold and he wasn’t sober enough to drive home. I told I’m multiple times that was a crappy way to arrest someone. I actually lost a lot of respect for him for doing so. The guy was trying to do the right thing.

    I guess a lot come with were you are located as well. NYPD and LAPD are going to have a complete different attitude towards police work then the police in western KS somewhere.

  • Madeline Grace

    I agree, I’ve been pulled over and asked dumb questions like that before as well. I didn’t get a ticket but I was pissed afterwards anyhow. I also agree with Steve that I don’t think all cops are bad either. I’ve been helped by a few cops that went out of their way for me, far above and beyond what they needed to do. We don’t hear about the good things they do, but we sure hear about the bad.
    From what I’ve read, it sounds as if Steve is one of the good ones. How many cops would pay for your gas out of their own pocket just to keep from arresting you.

  • StevenLNew

    Thanks Madeline… and Doc… I do try to be a good guy.
    I will say that I think sometimes the police is just trying to start conversation. I could see me asking someone in scrubs why they were out so late, but it wouldn’t be me trying to be mean or rude, It would have been me trying to start a conversation… Hoping you would say something like, In surgery for 4 hours… Saved a guys life. It wouldn’t have been me asking bcause I thought you were up to no good. I wasn’t there, so maybe he was being a @ss.
    about 10 years ago, a was flying down a 2 lane hwy. He saw me and pulled over fairly quickly after I lit up… I came up to his window and asked to see his pilot license, (Thinking that was a funny thing to ask for.) So he gave me his pilot license. I didn’t get mad, and say listen her smart @ss… Seeings I was the one being the wiseguy. I just took his pilot license back to my car, and ran him by social security number. (they were on them back then) He had no wants or warrants, so I took him back his pilos license and told him to land his plane and slow down before he gets grounded. He just smiled at me and said thank you officer and he was sorry. before he took off. ( I often wonder what was going on in his mind when he gave me his pilot license. He did exatly what I asked so I couldn’t really get mad… I was laughing my butt off and still do 10 years later.
    But the moral to that story is sometimes I think people just read the police wrong. It was a dumb way for me to ask for someones license, but I wasn’t mad at him for anything, and I hope he wasn’t mad at me for asking him for his pilot license either. I don’t think he was, he was very polite and smiled and kind of chuckled when I handed it back to him.
    And again… I’m not saying there are no cocky, or bully police officers out there. I know there are… I just don’t think it’s the majority of them. Of course maybe in NY or CA it is.
    I started posting on these posts just to say that not all cops are bad… AND IF YOU THINK SO like Ernie, Ed, (same person) or Roy… Your arguements are WORTHLESS… That’s like saying all Priests are child molestors which is obviously not true.

  • StevenLNew

    I will have to appologize for one thing, Some of your responses were going to my spam folder and some to my inbox. (Not sure why) I didn’t know that until I logged in at home.

    I really think that we were just on the wrong page.

    When I said I would take you to jail because you didn’t answer my question… I’m not saying I would just come up to someone ask them their name, and if they don’t tell me they are going to jail.

    What I was saying if you are caught in some kind of criminal act… You don’t have to tell me you name… But you will go to jail and I will find out who you really are.

    I would never just walk up to someone who is walking down the street, and for no apparent reason ask them their name in the 1st place. That would make no sense.

    I think since I wasn’t getting all the story it could have sounded a bit different.

  • StevenLNew

    Who arrested him? OH YEAH… COPS!!!

  • StevenLNew

    I don’t disagree, but there is usually more to the story, and if there isn’t… That police officer should be thrown in jail and the keys flushed down the toilet.

  • StevenLNew

    There is a difference between defending yourself and resisting arrest.
    AND there should be an investigation to any police officer caught beating someone, but where does it cross the line from one defending themselves to actually fighting with the police officers? I have seen a many of videos where it looks bad on tape, but then when you hear the susoect saying FU pigs, I’m going to kill everyone of you and hitting and biting everytime a police officer grabs him.
    If you are just watching one dash cam it looks horrible, if you see it from the officers mic camera and hear her screamming stop biting me. It looks more ligit… And I’m not saying it was or wasn’t either way.

  • StevenLNew

    It amazes me how many cop haters there are anymore, and maybe its the few bad apples in every department that has made that possible I don’t know.

    I will say when most people who encounter the police, it’s usually in a negative way. You get pulled over for speeding and get a ticket. We are not fireman who go into save the day. We get called in because someone beat their wife or beause someone broke in to someone elses home, or because some just shot up a school, or stabbed one of you kids.
    I’m not saying that ALL police officers are good and and there are NO bad cops out there.
    I will say that being a cop can be one of the most rewarding jobs ever, and one of the toughest jobs ever. I have had days were I loved being a cop, and days where I hated it.
    We risk our lives everyday for strangers, We put up with dirtbags, drug dealers, and drunks everday, but we also get to help people find their loved ones who got loss…
    Or as in 911 we get to save lives by helping others get out of a burning building that was about to collapse. 71 police officers lost their lives that day, and many have died since then. (and I know some of you just don’t care you just hate cops)

    Sometimes people just take what a police officer says the wrong way. When he says why are you out so late? It’s not ALWAYS meant to be a negitive qurstions, and he may not be trying to be sneaky to get you to confess to something. (usually it doesn’t happen that way)
    Most of the time its just to start a dialect… Not to be nosey.

    I’m sure there are times when it is being nosey, and you’re right sometimes it is none of our buisness, but then sometimes it is our business too. who knows maybe a building close by just got broke into just 5 minutes prior. Or maybe he was just being an ass.
    Sometimes cops don’t have a sense of humor… We are lied to EVERY DAY. (that’s why the divorce rate is so high among police officers because they can tend to stop trusting people after being lied to for so many years) Some cops have great sense of humor too. I just posted this a few hours ago, but it falls in line with what I’ve been saying.

    FUNNY STORY
    About 10 years ago, a car was flying down a 2 lane hwy. He saw me and pulled over fairly quickly after I lit up… I came up to his window and asked to see his pilot license, (Thinking that was a funny thing to ask for.) So he gave me his pilot license. I didn’t get mad, and say listen her smart @ss… Seeings I was the one being the wiseguy. I just took his pilot license back to my car, and ran him by social security number. (they were on them back then) He had no wants or warrants, so I took him back his pilots license and told him to land his plane and slow down before he gets grounded. He just smiled at me and said thank you officer and he was sorry. before he took off. ( I often wonder what was going on in his mind when he gave me his pilot license. He did exatly what I asked so I couldn’t really get mad… I was laughing my butt off, and still do 10 years later.

    But the moral to that story is sometimes I think people just read the police wrong. It was a dumb way for me to ask for someones license, but I wasn’t mad at him for anything, and I hope he wasn’t mad at me for asking him for his pilot license either. I don’t think he was, he was very polite and smiled and kind of chuckled when I handed it back to him.

    And again… I’m not saying there are NO cocky, or bully police officers out there. I know there are… I just don’t think it’s the majority of them. Of course maybe in NY or CA it is.

    I started commenting on these posts just to say that NOT ALL cops are bad… AND IF YOU THINK SO like Ernie, Ed, (same person) or Roy… Your arguements are WORTHLESS… That’s like saying all Priests are child molestors which is obviously not true.

    That is all, I’m done responding.

  • Craig

    Cops are useless and never do the job they were hired to do. They are under educated in every form of the law except the few laws and statutes that they need to know in order to write citations. There is no such thing as speed in any vehicle code book for any state, but the average person does not take the time to read the rules so they allow themselves to take the ticket. There are suggested speed limits for commercial vehicles in the vehicles code book which refers to tracker trailer drivers. Cops are Bullies and should be relieved of their jobs and all the illegal shootings of innocent people within the past to weeks prove this. Cops are criminal who did not get caught doing crimes before they became cops. Read the constitution, bill of rights and human rights laws this will tell you everything you need to know.

  • Craig

    You can defend yourself against Cops attack under the 4th and 16th amendments as well as human rights laws and if you ever took a oath office then your duty is protect yourself and country from foreign as well as DOMESTIC Terrorists (COPS). All your vehicle need to have dash cameras to record the events to save your self in court though.

  • StevenLNew

    Obviously a HATER and your uneducated comment is POINTLESS.

  • Taketwothey’resmall

    You just go on believing that. Smile, wait for flash….

  • Taketwothey’resmall

    The officer may have been a jerk, but not because you were exceeding the posted limit. The officer can’t “check your record” on the roadside unless you have an active case pending, a warrant, or are on probation/parole for traffic related convictions. It is your duty to elect representatives who will see that roadways are correctly and properly surveyed for safe speeds, and posted according to the law. If 50 is too slow, then it’s on you.

    If he wrote you for 6 over, he probably had plenty of time to write up every violation he could find with your less-than-new vehicle. Probably a good thing you were polite.

    Also, check with the local recorder in regards to that road. If it’s posted below the state maximum limit (usually 55 for uncontrolled highways), with no survey on file, then the speed limit reduction is invalid. The same goes for most traffic control postings on the road. They can’t arbitrarily put up a sign without legal process, except in immediate emergencies or construction/repair in progress. Most signs are either not properly posted, or have expired surveys, are faded (fails to meet the minimum reflective standard, etc.). Almost no survey is indefinite, and they must be exempted or have a survey review and validation date.

  • roy

    they were.

  • roy

    without important details, everything sounds different from what it really is.

  • roy

    this article is about how to avoid excessive oppression in a routine traffic stop (as if a traffic stop were routine for anyone besides a government oppressor) when you say that someone not answering your questions is ripe for jail time, but fail to give further details for your scenario that you’re implying, everyone (or at least me anyway) will expect it’s the scenario referred to in the article that we’re commenting on.

  • roy

    you’re expecting me to “comply” with you. i’m not going to obey you. go read your own posts. any more proof needed that you’re an oppressor besides your own words? you want me to quote you. you’re not worth quoting. you say you asked me, but you commanded. even if you’d asked, i wouldn’t have to placate you, but then again, cops really hate the idea of rights and freedom because it takes away their club for bullying people. go find someone else to command.

  • roy

    great things written down, but the hand of the oppressor doesnt’ recognize them. and neither do the courts.

  • roy

    to cops, their hegemony is more important that any of your rights.

  • StevenLNew

    So me asking you to prove where I contradicted myself is some how commanding you to do so? You are a complete lost cause. lol

    You can claim I contradicted myself until you are blue in the face, but since you can’t prove it, OR WONT then it is a useless argument that I actually contradicted myself.

  • StevenLNew

    I agree, that’s why I wanted to apologize.

  • StevenLNew

    Call it what you want… Chris Rock has one just like it you can look up on YouTube…It’s hilarious, and I think you would get a kick out of it. I would ask you to look it up, but some how you would turn that around telling me I commanded you to look it up. lol

    But IF you want a good laugh… Look up Chris Rocks ” How Not To Get Your A$$ Kicked By The Police.”

  • roy

    you told me to quote you. i refused. i referred to your own posts. you’re being disingenuous about it even now. i proved your contradictions. i did it without quoting. you never answered the examples of the contradictions and used the lack of quoting as part of the reason for dismissal. you can’t even be honest about that.

  • StevenLNew

    Obviously I didn’t tell you to do anything… Because we have never talked before EVER.

    I did however ask you to show me were I contradicted myself by copying and pasting what I said… You claim now you won’t do that because it’s a demand… (not sure how that’s a demand)

    BUT WE ALL KNOW YOU DON’T BECAUSE YOU CAN’T!!!

    Because I didn’t!!!

    Kind of like when you claimed I called you a bank robber several times… Then you actually did copy and paste what I wrote, and you didn’t notice the small word IF. “If you robbed a bank” that a huge difference from say you are a bank robber.

    So one minute you did copy and paste… When you thought you were right. (but turned out you were wrong)

    But when you claim I contradicted myself… You refuse to show me that?!?!?!? (because you know you are wrong again)

  • StevenLNew

    You referred to my own posts, by adding your own words.

    Like you claiming I called you a bank robber right? (which we both know that never happened)

    Proof isn’t referring someone to something.
    It’s proving to someone. Which we all know you can’t do.

  • StevenLNew

    That’s like me claiming Obama said he hates all white people… And when some said prove he said that, and I say, “No I don’t have to, He said it because I said he did.” That’s not Proof… Poof is showing someone something, Like copying and pasting what some one said.
    Like when you claimed I called you a bank robber and when you copied and pasted it… It showed, I stated If you robbed a bank… That’s not calling you a bank robber.

  • roy

    look at your own behavior on here and you’ll see hating cops is justified. maybe you should go about life for a day as a non-cop and see how the police treat you. you might also consider getting educated as you seem to refer to everyone you talk down to here as uneducated, ignorant, etc. anyone reading your posts can see your lack of use of correct spelling and grammar as a rule rather than the exception.

  • gradyphilpott

    Craig, You’re useless.

  • roy

    how aabout i repost since you obviously didn’t get it the first time:

    ” the proof is on your own posts. the proof is the assumption of guilt plainly manifest in your writing while saying you presume innocence. the proof is saying you follow the constitution when your arguments for such show you haven’t read it. the proof is saying you believe in the right to remain silent (even though the canonized right is not to remain silent, but rather to not be forced to incriminate oneself) while saying that if someone doesn’t answer your questions that it gives you the right to throw them in jail. the proof is actual contradictions. how can you not see that your contradictions are the proof of your contradictions?! do all cops actually think they’re telling the truth when they’re lying? it would explain a lot. maybe you guys aren’t dishonest on purpose, eh? maybe you’re all just crazy and need some serious therapy? ”

    i can’t find the others. they must have been deleted, but this is more than enough. if you want, i can post this every time you say i didn’t prove that you contradicted yourself so everyone can see the references to the contradictions and then go back to your posts and read them to see i didn’t make it up. you even conceded that you changed the context of your scenarios you posed in attempts to make them seem more reasonable, but you did so backhandedly saying that you just forgot to state that information and then even apologized backhandedly for that.

  • gradyphilpott

    Vic, you’re an ass.

  • gradyphilpott

    If the margin of error is +/-3mph, then at 56mph in a 50mph zone, his goose is still cooked.

    It’s a bitch getting a ticket, but take it like a man. You can argue the case in court. I’ve done so and won without a lawyer. My last ticket was for doing 118mph in a 75mph zone.

    I was polite and apologetic and took my ticket without any belly-aching and when I got back from my trip, I paid it like a man and I don’t go around badmouthing cops for doing their jobs.

    The officer was kind enough to drop 15mph from my ticket so that it saved me some money and maybe even some jail time.

    People who hate cops are either outright criminals or they’re stupid teenagers who think that because they’re on the internet, they can act like a bad ass.

    Either way, cop haters are the curse on our nation, not the cops.

  • gradyphilpott

    Ernie, you what drunks call a “dry drunk.”

  • StevenLNew

    Well 1st off of have been completely respectful this whole time, I’ve never made any accusations… that was you. Once I called you numb nuts, but that’s a military thing… You have been rude, you have posted nothing but hate filled comments on here about me and ALL cops.
    I even apologized once because I wasn’t getting all of you messages and I thought that was some of are differences, but you haven’t apologized about anything… even with your frivolous lies and accusation.

    So for you to think it’s my behaviour that’s been bad? I just have to laugh. LOLOL
    You crank me up. That’s all that’s left for you is laughter. If you care to keep making a fool of yourself that’s fine… I will keep humoring you.

    It’s time to move out of your parents basement and get a life of your own.

    Now, that’s the 1st rude thing I have ever said to you.

  • StevenLNew

    It’s funny how you can copy and paste what you wrote but not what I wrote.

    You can’t why? Because I haven’t contradicted myself once.

    But you keep claiming I did if you feel its necessary, but that doesn’t make it true.

  • roy

    if you want proof that obama hates white people, you should look for it in his own writings. i’m not sure what hating or not hating white people has to do with this ridiculous discussion, but i reposted part of the proof you keep requiring of me since you said i didn’t prove anything.

    frankly, i keep wanting to believe you’re one of the rare good cops out there. but, then you post more crap that proves otherwise. statistically speaking, not all cops can be completely bad. but, the more you post the crap you’ve been posting, the more i am convinced my initial reaction was too weak. you actually don’t see the contradictions, the dishonesty, or any of the attitude of superiority that you’re exhibiting, do you? all this at the bottom of a story that tells the average citizen to bend over and take it. people are beyond sick of having their rights violated by the government. the most common way this happens is encounters with the police. try being a teenager driving anywhere. try being a middle-aged man in a fancy but cheap car. try being a college student driving a beater. try asking a cop for directions. try helping your fellow man get unstuck in the middle of the winter. try helping an elderly driver off the road when their car stalls in the middle of an intersection. see how the police treat you. watch how they destroy private property at their whim. watch how they beat people for existing. see how everyone doing something good is first seen as a criminal who needs to be punished instead of someone living their own life in peace or trying to help their fellow man. try not being a cop for a while and see

  • roy

    anyone can read your posts. everything you’ve said to me has been rude. even your apology was backhnded.

  • roy

    since you won’t take it seriously (of course you wouldn’t, you’re a cop) how about we just let people read my posts and your posts and let them judge for themselves, eh?

  • StevenLNew

    Well 1st you have never tried to see me possibly being one of the good ones… You said right off all cops are bad. All you stated. You have done nothing but trash me since I wrote my 1st response, which simply stated not ALL cops are bad.
    You claimed things that are not true, you keep claiming I’ve contradict myself with out proving I did.

    I haven’t been the police my whole life FYI.
    I stopped being a policeman several years ago to work on the railroad. So I know what it’s like not to be a cop.

  • StevenLNew

    Really? I’ve have not said anything rude until the last post… not once. Besides numb nuts. Which again that was a marine thing.

    As far as my apology? Sorry I’m not sure how that was a bad thing. You should read it again. It was completely a legit apology. Why else would I apologize to someone who’s been nothing but rude to me?

  • StevenLNew

    Aaaa anyone who can read can see for themselves who has been rude here and it’s definitely hasn’t been me.

    Your 1st word to me were all cops are lying just looking to take people to jail.

  • Dawson

    All though I don’t disagree with everything you have said roy I will say Steven hasnt been the rude one here. You’ve been a pretty big jack ass from the beginning, and i have read every word.

  • roy

    all those examples i gave you were just small samples of times police have assumed guilt of something in me and abused me and the people i was trying to help for no reason other than getting their authority off. you said you’re a cop. you asserted it many times. now you say you’re no longer a cop. get your story straight.

  • roy

    he’s definitely been rude. of course i’m a jack ass to a cop. that’s all they’ve ever been to me.

  • Madeline Grace

    I will agree with Steve. You have been the rudest so far even though his last few comments have been starting to turn more rude, but who can blame him.

  • StevenLNew

    1st I don’t recall you claiming you were trying to help anyone in any scenario… I don’t even recall you talking about anything abuse you ever got from the police either. maybe I missed that in my spam folder.

    2nd I am a police officer, I never claimed I didn’t go back to police work.
    I will explain so you don’t think I’m a lying cop. LOL I did leave police work for a few years to drive a locomotive… I went back to doing police work on the reserve side so I could keep my commission. A few years later I left the railroad (during union disputes) and went back to police work full time. That was 9 years ago.

  • roy

    we’re posting on an article that effectively tells the average person to bend over and take it when the police pull you over. steve’s been a cop apologist and defender the whole time, completely supporting everything the cop in the article says. when i pointed out his contradictions he consistently refused to actually address them, but instead kept telling me to prove them. if you think about it from a sane perspective, you’ll see that the attitude that people magically have no rights when a police officer is involved isn’t just rude, it’s demonstration of oppression. do you not want me to be hostile to that? think about what he’s actually saying and the consequences of treating it respectfully.

  • roy

    how about you address the details i gave of your contradictions? ever considered doing that instead of dismissing them?

  • roy

    dismissal is easier than confronting the actual facts of what you’ve said here. try actually addressing them.

  • StevenLNew

    lol You haven’t given me any proof I contradicted myself… You refuse to show me were I did?

  • roy

    again:

    the proof is on your own posts. the proof is the assumption of guilt plainly manifest in your writing while saying you presume innocence. the proof is saying you follow the constitution when your arguments for such show you haven’t read it. the proof is saying you believe in the right to remain silent (even though the canonized right is not to remain silent, but rather to not be forced to incriminate oneself) while saying that if someone doesn’t answer your questions that it gives you the right to throw them in jail.

  • StevenLNew

    Not dismissing anything. Please please… I beg you to copy and paste were I contradicted myself!!! Please!!!
    So I can address it.
    That’s not a demand… That’s me begging you to actually prove just 1 thing!!!

  • roy

    like i said, i’m not going to copy and paste your words:

    the proof is on your own posts. the proof is the assumption of guilt plainly manifest in your writing while saying you presume innocence. the proof is saying you follow the constitution when your arguments for such show you haven’t read it. the proof is saying you believe in the right to remain silent (even though the canonized right is not to remain silent, but rather to not be forced to incriminate oneself) while saying that if someone doesn’t answer your questions that it gives you the right to throw them in jail.

  • StevenLNew

    I’ve addressed all those already…

    1st I never once said I presume innocents I have said several times I don’t presume innocents or guilt… I got by evidence.

    2nd I never said I would force anyone to incriminate ones self. Not once. This is why you should copy and paste. Cause that was never said by me. You must be getting your arguments mixed up. I believe in the right to remain silent. I even stated I have had to stop people from talking to read them their rights because the started confessing to me.

    3rd I stated if I got someone in an illegal activity and he refused to answer my questions he was still going to jail. Because you claimed that the police can’t not arrest someone as long as he pleads the 5th which is when I had to explain to you the difference between pleading the 5th and our Miranda right to remain silent.

    Do you remember this conversation now?
    I sure hope so.

  • StevenLNew

    That is the problem… You keep claiming I said something that I never said. Like when you said I called you a bank robber which we both know I didn’t do.

    That’s why you should copy and paste. That’s actually proof. Not when you make false accusations about things I never said.

  • StevenLNew

    Hmmm looks as if I am winning. 2 people said you have been the jerk so far.

  • roy

    you’re a cop. they’re afraid of you. everyone is.

  • StevenLNew

    LOL I’m sure LOL NOT LOL

  • roy

    whenever anyone here mentioned something unjust that a cop did to someone innocent you insisted that they were likely wrong. you insisted that it was more likely that they violated some law or didn’t comply in some way. if i didn’t do anything wrong, why should i have to comply? isn’t this supposed to be a free country?

    you didn’t say you’d force someone to incriminate themselves, but you did say that you have the right to imprison them if they don’t answer your questions. you changed your story when it was pointed out that you said you had the right to imprison them for not answering your questions (effectively at your whim).

    the whole taking part in an illegal activity reference developed afterwards. of course if someone is caught in the act of violating someone else’s rights, they should be taken in. you never mentioned that in your posts until after i pointed out that you were saying you could arrest at your own whim. but you wouldn’t know someone was taking part in an illegal activity unless you had some evidence. you might conveniently change the circumstances in your posts as you go along to make it seem like you’re justified, but those changes weren’t in the original set of circumstances posted. you also created a very convenient example in coming up with the illegal activity instead of an example of the kind of information you’d use to make that decision.

    you didn’t explain to me miranda rights. you tried to distract from the point i was making about your contradictions by reiterating judicial precedence. it’s distracting even now. you never got that the 4th and 5th amendments, taken in their entirety is intended to keep you from arbitrarily arresting people. they have to have violated someone’s rights for you to be able to do so, and it has to be provable. this is the opposite of your original assertion.

  • StevenLNew

    See this is were you lose all ground for any arguement.

    Wrong #1: I don’t insist that they are wrong… I have always stated from the beginning, that I believe that SOMETIMES people just take the questioning the wrong way. Maybe there was a legit reasoning for them to ask you some question. MAYBE they were looking for a car just like the one they were driving, ect. Because you claim Cops are ALWAYS Lying and looking to throw someone in jail. I even stated SEVERAL time, after saying what I said… I DON’T KNOW, I WASN’T THERE AND MAYBE HE (the cop) WAS JUST BEING AN A$$.

    Wrong #2: EXACTLY I did not say I would force someone to incriminate themself. When you claimed I did.
    Thank you for admitting that.
    ALSO… IF you would have been paying attention to the post like you claim you do. You would have seen that during that conersation we were talking about catching a drunk driver… You claimed if they didn’t answer any of my questions, I could not take them to jail… I stated just because you don’t answer my questions doens’t mean you are not going to jail… I would still take you to jail. Which is true.

    Wrong #3: I did explain the miranda rights to you… We were still talking about the DUI when you piped up talking about pleading the 5th, talking about your constitutional rights… When I was talking about reading someone their miranda rights.

    That is an example of us being on 2 different pages at the same time.
    I’m not stating you didn’t know the difference… I just stated pleading the 5th isn’t what you do, at that tiime… You invoke your right to remain silent… Although they both have to do with self-incriminatin, one is just use in court proceedings (the 5th) and one is used for police officers in the field. (mirianda)

    AGAIN I don’t think we dissagree with each other on most things… You even stated above, you agreed when to take someone to jail showing evidence ect… WHICH I have stressed SEVERAL times… I only go by EVIDENCE. I DON’T presume anyone is innocent or guilty… I go by EVIDENCE. I have said that at least a dozen times.

    What we do dissagree on is that you say ALL COPS ARE BAD!!!
    I say MOST are not… BUT yes there are a bad cops out there.
    I have stated that at least a dozen times as well.

  • Madeline Grace

    even though i don’t agree with the cops all the time doesn’t mean i am going to be rude to them. the article is not telling anyone bend over and take it. it is just saying be respectful and don’t lie to the cops. at least that is the way i took it. you are just over the top angry at every cop, from what i have read so far.
    did you really expect a cop not to back what another cop says?
    i have read every post between you all so far and i haven’t seen him not answer your questions. he has answered everyone so far.
    you keep trying to piss him off for some reason. i have seen him say he was sorry. i have heard his story about pay for someones gas. i even wrote him say i think he was one of the rare good cops and wished there were more like him.
    you can’t see the good in any cop, that is very apparent. or you would just simply say. steve you are right not all cops are bad but there are bad ones out there. it sounds like you are one in a thousand even. yet you refuse to back off of him. even after he has tried to explain time and time again.
    i think you bit off more than you can chew with steve. i wasn’t expecting him to hang in there as long as he has. but apparently he is trying to get through to you that he isn’t the bad cop you make him out to be.

  • roy

    of course i expect every cop to back up every other cop, regardless of the atrocity that cop is committing. and of course he hasn’t stopped. cops always insist on being right and enforcing it with whatever brutality they can get away with using to do so. if you don’t agree with them, they will persist until you submit. if it’s in person they’ll use whatever physically violent tactic they can until you either give in or they kill you. you should never expect any cop to admit being wrong unless they’re taking part in the dialectical arguing tactic of conceding a point in an attempt to gain more ground in other areas. if a cop is doing that, it’s because he’s in a situation where he can’t physically control you. otherwise, he’d be using physical brutality.

    i won’t give in anymore. i’m not going to stop helping people because some government bully tells me not to help them. i’m sick of being told i can’t help people. i can give food to people who are hungry if i want. i can give money to poorer people than me if i want. it’s my food and my money and i can do what i want with it. they’ll have to put me in prison if they want to stop me next time because i won’t stop giving to people anymore. if i see someone stuck on the side of the road, i’ll still help them anyway. the next time they tell me to stop helping people i’ll just ignore them. i won’t stop helping people from now on. i’m sick of being pulled over for no reason other than my car looks fancy. i’m sick of my privacy being violated because i have a relative who may have committed a real crime 3 decades ago. i’m sick of being treated like refuse for living a peaceful life and helping my fellow man. it’s always a cop telling me i’m not allowed to do this stuff. it’s always a cop accusing me of driving drunk or stealing or doing something that shouldn’t even be illegal, all because i helped someone on the side of the road or gave food to someone who was hungry or tried to do something else that was good. of course i’m angry at every cop. all they do is brutalize me for trying to be a good person.

  • roy

    show me where it says that in the constitution.

  • StevenLNew

    Apparently you’ve never heard of Exigent Circumstances… So I will copy and paste it for you. Don’t just read the beginning… read it all because it gets involved with what we were talking about in the 1st place DUI’s

    (And again we were talking about, you claiming as long as a person doesn’t speak to me I can’t take them to jail, and I was talking about me arresting someone on a DUI.)

    Exigent circumstance

    Main article: Exigent circumstance in United States law

    Law enforcement officers may also conduct warrantless searches in several types of exigent circumstances where obtaining a warrant is dangerous or impractical. One example is the Terry stop, which allows police to frisk suspects for weapons.[103]The Court also allowed a search of arrested persons in Weeks v. United States (1914) to preserve evidence that might otherwise be destroyed and to ensure suspects were disarmed.[103][104] In Carroll v. United States(1925),[82] the Court ruled that law enforcement officers could search a vehicle that they suspected of carrying contraband without a warrant.

    [103] The Court allowed blood to be drawn without a warrant from drunk-driving suspects in Schmerber v. California (1966) on the grounds that the time to obtain a warrant would allow a suspect’s blood alcohol content to reduce.[103][105] Warden v. Hayden (1967) provided an exception to the warrant requirement if officers were in “hot pursuit” of a suspect.[106][103]

  • roy

    that’s judicial precedence. you said it’s in the constitution. show me where it says what you said is in the constitution.

  • StevenLNew

    The 4th Amendment

  • Boogietronix

    If pulled over at night, it’s a good idea to turn on the interior light as well as keeping your hands on the wheel. Anything that makes the officer pulling you over feel like they can see everything is a good idea. Unless you really need to hide something!

  • levria loveless

    No i would just say Darwin’s law and move on-

    I mean com-on no brainier-

    Dont think you could kill anyone because your silly-

  • percychow

    Craig – FWIW… until these guys get a decent job, a house, the wife and kids, they’ll never understand how important cops, solidiers, firefighters, even the garbage man are to a working society.

    Of course there are some bad public servants (Congress to name a bunch) – but personally, with all my rice-burning cars, and loud exhausts over my teens and 20s, I only had one cop who clearly was been a jerk… all the other dozen or so were professional.

    I’ve probably met more A**hole mechanics and “car guys” then cops in my lifetime.

    Keep up the good work sir.

  • levria loveless

    maybe they are flirting with you-

  • levria loveless

    If cops are such good lie detectors why do they keep voting democrat?

  • StevenLNew

    Thank you percychow. I appreciate the kind words. (Apparently unusual on here) I agree with you 100% especially about congress some times. LOL. I think you are right about how things change when you get older and have more responsibilities. I too have been pulled over LOTS of times in my younger days. And I have had a few A** holes before as well but like you, the majority were very professional, even when I was signing my ticket.

    Again thank you… it’s people like you who make me like doing my job, and makes even the hard days worth coming back day in and day out.

  • LeftyS7

    They don’t, they are as Conservative as you can get despite living a Socialist life style-completely supported by the State.

  • LeftyS7

    Don’t bother reading “What To Do” it’s just the opposite of these.

  • roy

    the 4th amendment says the exact opposite.

  • StevenLNew

    That’s because you only read what you want to hear. Here let me copy and paste for you.
    I know how you like to miss key words like when I said IF you robbed a bank, and you claimed I called you a bank robber.

    The right of the people to be secure in their persons, houses, papers, and effects, against unreasonable searches and seizures, shall not be violated, and no Warrants shall issue, but upon probable cause, supported by Oath or affirmation, and particularly describing the place to be searched, and the persons or things to be seized.

    Keys words to look for…
    1st) unreasonable
    2nd) probable Causes.

    From the beginning… I have always stated I do everything by evidence and probable cause.

    Please keep up Roy. LOL

  • O’neil Junior

    You sure you were a police? Who did your paperwork for you?

  • O’neil Junior

    And you are not?

  • O’neil Junior

    Have you seen the kid in the wheelchair being pushed over? He was charged with assaulting a police! Sad thing was that the video was from the police car dash cam. With that said, good luck with your dash cam video when they jack you up.

  • StevenLNew

    Was and still am… Please feel free to let me know where I am wrong… or are you just another cop hater too?

  • StevenLNew

    What a great come back?!?!

  • Ray

    Steven, while I respect you as an apparently good cop, I still have to confess that I do not trust cops in general. I’m always respectful when I encounter them, and I don’t go out of my way to be ornery; however, because there are a good number of bad cops, it makes it difficult to trust any of them, because you never know which ones are bad.

    Once, a friend of mine, who was a mother of 4 small children and pregnant at the time, was pulled over because her license was expired. She said that she had purchased the new sticker, but it hadn’t come in the mail yet. The policeman made her and all her children get out of the car and stand on the side of the road while he had her car towed, and then he drove off and left her there. She had to call her husband to come pick her up, and then she and all her children had to stand on the side of the road for 40 minutes waiting for him to get there.

    I don’t care who you are, that’s just insane. How can I trust a cop when I don’t know how they’re going to act? How can I tell which ones are good guys like you, and which ones are megalomaniacs out on a power trip? Just like cops tend to assume a person is a threat until proven otherwise, I assume all cops cannot be trusted until proven otherwise. Some cops are good…maybe even most, but enough of them are bad to make it very hard to trust any of them.

  • roy

    who only reads what they want to read? “…and no warrants shall issue but upon probable cause, supported by oath or affirmation…” you quoted it and you still don’t get it. you think it means the opposite of what it says. it’s a protection of my rights against your brutal whim. you’re logic is completely backwards. it says you can’t do anything to anyone unless you go get the proper piece of paper using documented proof that there’s a reason to do it. you’ve got to go under oath and present your evidence to get that piece of paper. it doesn’t say you can pick someone up for probable cause. it says you can get a warrant to do it if you’ve got probable cause and present the evidence that gives you said probable cause under oath. and the search also has to be reasonable or it’s not legal and a warrant shouldn’t be issued. how can anyone take you or the rest of the current incarnation of the “justice system” seriously when you use judicial precedence and backwards logic to pretend like the constitution doesn’t mean anything?!

  • roy

    whenever a cop speaks hypothetically to you, always affirm the opposite because it will eventually become an accusation and if you haven’t affirmed outright over and over again, they will trap you with your words.

  • StevenLNew

    Thanks Ray… At least you have a legit reasons to be weary of the police.

    Yes I would agree, that cop didn’t do what he should have done. It sounds like a situation gone wrong.

    I will say, and I’m not making excuses for his behavior… But over the last 15 years, things have changed for police officers as well. So many policeman get sued because they do the right things. Let me give you a court of example… And again I’m not saying that is what happened with your friends ordeal.

    I got a call when I was a rookie cop. (Early 90’s) it was a domestic, which are usually the worse calls we get. Anyhow when I arrived I met a gentleman who just wanted to get his stuff out of his home, because he and his wife had been arguing. He had a welt on his face (obviously a hand print) I asked him if she had smacked him and he replied she did but it was ok… my FTO (field training officer) asked me what I thought we should do, I told him, basically just let him get his stuff so he can go to his buddies house. He told me no… she’s going to jail. The gentleman even asked not to take her to jail. My FTO told when I get out on my own I will have more Officers Discretion to do things like that. Today… officers discretion has been getting taken away from us as police officers. There has been times were we didn’t take the person to jail, then several hours later someone is dead or badly beaten, because we didn’t take someone to jail. Next the department and the police officer are getting sued. Today… in most cities… during a domestic call usually someone is going to jail. Same thing goes with several calls, DUO’s, marijuana, and even failure to register a car. Although I would not have done that to your friend, but in my county I still have some officer discretion, but some of our near by cities do not, they basically take everyone to jail. It’s not because they want to, it because we are told to by out upper chain of command.
    Again I’m not saying that was the case.
    I still believe MOST cops are good and yes I have seen my share of bad ones.
    And again I’m am sorry for your and your friends bad experience.

  • StevenLNew

    Well you kept trying to prove me wrong for several days now, and you failed miserably.
    You tried putting words in my mouth, you accused me of things that never said and yet you call me a bad person. Hmmmm

    If you would have came at me and said Steven I believe there are a lot of bad cops out there, I couldn’t have argued that…
    If you would have said Steven, I think most cops are bad… we would have just disagreed, but no. You came at it stating ALL Cops are bad. They ALL lie and just want to take people to jail, they are ALL oppressors of people’s rights, and NONE of them can be trusted. Which makes your task of proving your point impossible. Because it’s lies and a complete wait of an argument.

  • StevenLNew

    I don’t vote democrat… I’m a staunch conservative.
    I will say LOTs of police departments are unionized so all they hear are the left’s point. My department is not unionized and 99 percent are conservatives.
    Just FYI

  • StevenLNew

    Well you are WRONG again. You read it the way you want to read it.

    You do realize that the constitution is much larger then just the constitution that’s written on a few pieces of paper right?

    This is why we have a Supreme Court to interpret the constitution, and they also make laws that expand on it.

    Hopefully you realize that.

    (But you probably don’t)

  • O’neil Junior

    Hmm? I am confused. Was that a question or was it meant to infer a statement?

  • StevenLNew

    Both.

  • roy

    you’re talking to a guy who doesn’t believes the 4th amendment says that he can’t search or arrest you without a warrant obtained with proof under oath. he thinks it means if he has probable cause in his own mind he can do with you as he pleases. how can you expect him to produce a coherent sentence?

  • roy

    why should we believe you vote for the lesser of the two evils? every cop i see on tv preaches against freedom of speech, the right to bear arms, the right to property, the right to liberty, the right to life, the right to freely practice religion, etc. every cop i meet in person has had the same attitude. they openly mock the idea of popular sovereignty, sometimes without even knowing it. they think they are above the law. they threaten to arrest people for giving food to homeless people. they threaten me with a beating if i don’t stop helping people on the side of the road because “it’s not your job, it’s mine. you’ll just cause more trouble.” or some other inane statement. why should anyone believe you’re different? because you came here and told a couple feel-good stories while saying it’s only 10% that are bad? that wonderful pillar of justice in connecticut said the police are the masters and the people are the servants. your backwards interpretation of the 4th amendment indicates you think the same way. how can we believe you’re actually different?

  • O’neil Junior

    His former high school football coach, Tom Cobble, said the allegations were “absolutely a shock.”

    “It’s so totally out of character, it’s unbelievable.” said Cobble, who retired from coaching at Chickasha last year.

    “We need to reach out to him and make sure he knows he’s loved,” Cobble said.

    Make sure he is loved alright, with a 5.56 FMJ between you know where. Bastards.

  • O’neil Junior

    Guess you have not been watching the news lately.

  • O’neil Junior

    Steven, you must be the exception when it comes to policemen. If that’s the case, please, preach to your fellow policemen to be good stewards and uphold the law. Just because they have a badge does not give them the right to abuse the citizens they swore to protect. I honestly feel that school for policemen needs to be longer. In Germany, the academy for an officer of the law is three years! Some of these guys here do a ride around for two weeks, are given a badge and gun, and have no clue what the Fourth amendment is.

  • StevenLNew

    What Cops have you ever seen on tv who has preached any of that?
    This I have to hear?
    I don’t care of you believe me or not, and something tells me your story of getting a beating for helping the homeless is a lie so people will buy into your hate filled rhetoric. After, what 4 days of you explaining why you hate cops and hearing ALL of your excuses… now you bring up the MOST devastating story of all times. Yeah… that’s believable. If it’s true I can see why you hate cops and I’m sorry for what you want through. I myself have given help to the homeless, food money (not very often money) but I have. So to believe a cop beat you for helping them is hard to believe.
    I have my ffl and I build guns for people. I am a proud member of the nra like most cops are. The majority of the members of the nra are cops. So I’m not why you think the way you do… or maybe I do… one minute you have called me everything in the book and tried to prove me wrong… when I put you in your place… You get mad and begin make stuff up to look like you are right. Starting to make sense now… I guess this story about how the police can’t tell when someone is lying turns out to be true huh?
    Stop with the lies… at least be honest.

  • O’neil Junior

    Everyone born required a mother and a father, Steven. A Bastard is a person born with parents NOT MARRIED TO EACH OTHER! Seriously, are you a police or some guy getting his jollies fucking with people because you get a woodie every time you see one of those clowns drive by in their clown cars?

  • roy

    it would make sense since he can’t even understand the 4th amendment.

  • roy

    neither does he. he thinks it means the opposite of what it says. he thinks it means he can arrest you if he has probable cause in his own mind. he doesn’t understand that the probable cause is used to get a warrant which has to be made under oath, thereby putting him at risk of perjury if he’s lying.

  • O’neil Junior

    Well said, man. If I could give you a billion likes, you would have it. Got jacked up one night, cuffed and shoved in a police car because the assclown asked me who some guys outside were. Told him I didn’t know because it was my first time visiting the neighbourhood to visit a girl. He accused me of lying, told me I was going to jail, searched my car and dumped everything out on the sidewalk, all the meantime I am in the car with the cuffs on too damn tight. It was only after a few good white policemen showed up and ran my military ID card that shithead decided to let me go. Then the ass had the audacity to tell me not to come back and if I did, he would arrest me. One of the reason I tote when I go.

  • roy

    me stop with the lies?! you didn’t even get what i said right. it was threatened with arrest for giving food to the homeless and threatened with a beating for helping a guy who was stuck. me and some other guys even helped an old lady whose car broke down in the middle of the night and a cop came by and accused us of driving drunk because of it. you never put me in my place. you’ve never even used valid logic on here. i must admit that most of the time when people beg for money from me that i refuse and instead ask them what they need and go buy it instead. i usually am afraid they’ll use the money for liquor or worse. i’ve been pulled over for not having insurance after having my car for four days. the putz who pulled me over asked to see my insurance. he knew very well that i didn’t have my card with me because the lovely government mail system isn’t that efficient and he knew it. but, my insurer notifies the government electronically so they had it the day i bought the car. he knew i had insurance. he was just harassing me because i’ve got a fancy car. he wanted to show me who’s boss. you don’t believe any of this, do you?! or maybe you do and you won’t admit it because you do the same thing to everyone else just the same as all the cops i’ve run into.

  • O’neil Junior

    Lol. I was just thinking the same thing, Roy.

  • roy

    he’s looking for guilt.

  • StevenLNew

    Actually junior… If you read what I wrote… I’m not the one who was calling anyone a bastard.. I stated that Ernie called all cops are lying bastards. I stated I’m not a bastard… I have a mother and a father. So… nothing I said was incorrect… right?
    Please Read Before Posting

  • roy

    if you go find the rest of my “conversation” with this nut, you’ll see that he interprets the 4th amendment as exactly the opposite of its meaning. he uses backwards logic and then tells me he put me in my place. he even mocked me and accused me of lying when giving examples of getting in trouble with the police for trying to be a good person. it’s like he’s in denial that it’s illegal to feed the homeless. that’s an obvious violation of my right to freely practice my religion.

  • O’neil Junior

    Ed, I am with Ernie. I don’t know about Steven, man.

  • roy

    they’re from connecticut, new york, california, and DC at least. i don’t remember their names. why would i care to remember them? it’s not as if you’ve never watched any of the BS from cops on tv.

  • O’neil Junior

    I asked something similar before. Was going to ask if he had spell check on his computer but decided to leave that one alone because you know how intelligent people these days like to have their rebuttal by getting upset and calling others gramma police

  • O’neil Junior

    “I will say that I think sometimes the police is just trying to start conversation”. Really? Are policemen/women of such low mental faculties that they cannot come up with better opening for conversation than some stupid questions? Mensch!

  • StevenLNew

    Well 1st… your no insurance card is a bogus claim. I just bought a new truck and had an insurance card within a couple of hours. Where are you from? I don’t know of any state that requires an insurance company to contact the government upon someone getting insurance, anyhow they have this thing called email and printers.

    As far as the homeless and giving them money. I agree with you… I’ve done the same things.

    As far as putting you in your place? What ever… You have told me I have been rude and contradicting, but couldn’t prove it. You have stated all cops lie, you claimed I called you a bank robber, you have made so many accusations about me and NONE of them have been true… You told me as long as someone doesn’t talk to me I can’t take them to jail and I have showed you how wrong you are, and yet you haven’t proven me wrong once. But not without trying. Most people call that putting someone in their place.

    You are right… I have a hard time believing your stories, because for 4 or 5 days, I have been asking you why you hate cops so much, and you have been trying to convince me why cops are bad… And here it is almost a week later… And you come up with this story. Also I have never heard of a police officer threatening a beating before. That’s just weird. There are so many cameras around now a days on people and police officers. We have dash cams and microphone cameras. So yes your story is pretty far fetched.
    I would never justify any police officer talking to anyone like that.
    And here you are again making accusations stating since If don’t believe your story, I’m a bad cop just like the rest.

    Let me ask you this… have you EVER had a good run in with ANY police officer?

  • StevenLNew

    See now you are just looking for something to disagree with me on. lol

    If you read the story before that you would understand?

    How are cops supposed to start a conversation with someone Jr.
    If I see someone out late in the night and I say to him… hey what are you up to tonight? You’re going to tell me that’s a bad way to start a conversation?

    No matter how a cop approaches you. You will find something wrong with it.

  • O’neil Junior

    I sure am, Steven.

  • O’neil Junior

    i am a retired Soldier, have the wife and children, and a job working for the U.S. army. I worry about my children daily because of police.

  • StevenLNew

    It obvious… Although you are from another country… So your opinion about American cops are useless don’t yahoo think?

  • roy

    i’m not going to tell you where i live. the state doesn’t require electronic notification. my insurance company just does it because they decided it’s a good policy for their customers. and why should i waste paper to placate the government when they already have documentation of my having insurance? that’s like the laws forcing you to sign your name on a ticket promising you’ll show up in court when they’ll throw you in jail for not doing so anyway. it’s a government mandated insult. isn’t the government content with their own ridiculous level of waste? why force the same ineptitude on me?! don’t they want me to be more efficient so they can extract more taxes?! it’s already printed out anyway! it was getting mailed to me anyway. i didn’t have to waste the paper because the insurance company already did!

    i haven’t had a good run in with a cop that i can recall. there was one that was relatively neutral very recently. i stopped to try to help these guys who wrecked really bad because the driver was drunk off his butt. the cops let me go without too much hassle because i didn’t witness the actual wreck.

  • roy

    btw, nice car. i have a buddy who lives forever away from me who drive a white one. maybe steven should be told how to recognize the difference between the japanese and american versions of the car you drive so he could tell you live in the states.

  • O’neil Junior

    Here is what you wrote that I responded to. “1st I have a mother and a father therefore not even a bastard.” I did read. I was merely giving the definition of what constitutes a Bastard, Steven. Hope you are not a detective. But then again, aren’t all police supposed to have the acuity of being able to pick up on things? Are you losing it?

  • O’neil Junior

    First off, the name is Junior, NOT Jr. Secondly, how about a polite, “Good day, afternoon, evening, sir. Nice day isn’t it?” People are less susceptible to think you are an ass in such a manner instead of the nonsense you guys come up with. In all my encounter with police in the USA, I have come away from the encounter feeling like I was victimized. In all my time in Europe, I came away feeling like I met a new friend. Why is that? Did you know that there they have the right to beat a person’s ass to get them to comply and here they are not? Maybe it is because they go to school for such a long time and learn the Rule of Law that they do not abuse their position. I don’t know what the fix is for the problem, Steven. I never had a problem with the Polizei because they treated me with dignity and respect, something the police here seems to lack. The cool thing in one of my encounter was the officer asking me things about the car and asked me to show him the engine because he liked it. Lol. Anyway, since you state you are one of the good guys, why don’t you start a society of good officers and do all you can to promote a good, positive attitude towards your community, and maybe it may catch on across the country. Did you see the video of the policeman pulling up to the boy out in the street, and instead of being an ass, he played basketball with him? That shows the humanity within people and we love that. We are tired of harassment, profiling, beatings, unfair judicial proceedings, and just plain tired of police abusing their authority.

    “Welcome to Walmart where you can receive a free police beating along with those great low prices as a fringe benefit.”

    https://www.facebook.com/photo.php?v=224736267724198&set=vb.100005634794495&type=2&theater

    https://www.youtube.com/results?search_query=police+brutality+2014

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qWbNXu9xgvA

    Hope these keep you entertained and will give you an insight as to the reasons why people feel the way they do. Personally, I feel war needs to be declared.

  • O’neil Junior

    Thanks, Roy. I would hope Steven is a car guy and would ask questions about it instead of beating my ass with his club, shooting me, then cuffing and tazering me after I am dead.

  • O’neil Junior

    Two question and exclamation marks? What is the emphasis on that? Please use only one exclamation mark per statement. You will appear less frantic to be heard, and don’t combine the two; makes you appear to be other than what you think you are. Have a good night Steve.

  • O’neil Junior

    I am from another country? Dude, please communicate. Do you know the definition of communication? Especially when writing!
    Let me repeat myself: “i am a retired Soldier, have the wife and children, and a job working for the U.S. army. I worry about my children daily because of police.” Should I have been more specific by saying, “I am a retired US army Soldier?” Think you could have found THAT clue? Or was this part not big enough of a clue for you? “and a job working for the U.S. army.” You told me to read, obviously that is not your forte’. Thought that you had to have those comprehension skills to be on the force. And yahoo? Hmm. That one did go way over my head. Now I am the clueless one. Good night and stay away from the donuts. It doesn’t cut a dashing figure on the dash cam swinging that baton on defenseless people.

  • roy

    i guess you could always hope. but maybe you shouldn’t let on that you’ve got a nice car. government commie control freaks hate it when you’ve got something nice…so i guess that’s my fault for bringing it up, eh? sorry man.

  • StevenLNew

    1st. I only ask because again I’ve never heard of that before. It sounds dumb, because we as police officers have No clue whether or not someone has insurance or not… it’s not something that is in ncic my wife happens to own her own insurance company… she told me she has never heard of that before either… I’m sure you perfectlyant me to know what state to live in because you know I will find out you are lying… why else would you be afraid of filling EVERYONE in what state you live in. LOL

    2nd. Here is were I school you once again…
    Why would you ”waist paper?” Because it’s required… duh. Don’t get mad at the police just because you don’t want to ”waist paper” that’s the dumbest thing I have ever head before… seeing you can get a packet of 2 thousand for around a penny. Not only that Tons of insurance companies now forward you policy to your email so you can show the officer who pulls you over on your phone that you have insurance. Costing you nada… But I’m sure you will find something wrong with that too huh?

    If you’re not already… You should go join the group sovereign nation… You would fit in perfect, but something tells me you already know this. Huh?

  • StevenLNew

    Psst… my parents are still married. So again that makes me not a bastard.
    What does that have to do with anything?
    Doesn’t Germany have their own websites to comment on?
    Your arguments are irrelevant here.

  • StevenLNew

    Really?!?!

  • StevenLNew

    All you have ever said about were you are from is that you are from Germany.

    Not sure how I could have come up with you are a retried soldier working for the US Army in Germany. That’s pretty far fetched don’t yahoo think?

    So you are going to tell me, as a former soldier, that you have NEVER had a good experience with a police officer too?

    Really?!?!?!?!?!

  • roy

    no, you’re asking because you want to get me in put in prison for something. part of me feels like i should apologize for not being completely honest about those incidents since i left out what you might consider crucial information or used slight hyperbole. i did so for the sake of coherence and hiding my identity. but then you persist in trying to find out where i live. i already admitted to things like giving food to the homeless which is illegal around here and i’m not interested in retribution for that or any other law i’ve violated, all of which are similar to the law saying you can’t feed the homeless. also, why should i apologize when you keep lying? pretending like the cops don’t have access to my insurance information is disingenuous. the guy even said he specifically pulled me over because his computer said i didn’t have insurance. but i’m not going to give you anymore information about these incidents because you could look me up just by them. i probably already gave you enough info to find me. but then again, maybe you’re not that resourceful? and it doesn’t matter that enforcing the laws i’ve violated is a felony. police don’t ever enforce the law that says enforcing illegal laws is a felony. i understand that law puts police between the proverbial rock and hard place because of politics, but again, that law is intended to protect my rights. it was made because the people writing the constitutions and some of the early laws knew that crazy politicians and hard-headed, purposefully ignorant police would respectively enact and enforce egregious laws. in the case of feeding the homeless, that law is protecting me from retribution for exercising my right to freely exercise my religion. but people like you don’t care about any of that. all you want to do is throw me in prison.

  • roy

    i didn’t say waist. i said waste.

  • O’neil Junior

    Steven, are you really that stupid? Never did I stated at any time that I was from Germany. Stop twisting people’s words. Oh, I forgot. You have been doing that ever since you became an upholder of the law. No wonder people don’t get along with the likes of you, and for a moment there I was about to give you the benefit of a doubt.
    Cannot see anything far fetched about spending 24 years as an Infantryman doing something you did not have the balls to do. Guess it is easier beating up innocent civilians than to face the enemy of your country, right, yahoo?
    See that your reading and comprehension skills have a lot to be desired. I did mention having good run ins with the law; just not in the good ol’ USA.

  • O’neil Junior

    No need to be, Roy.

  • O’neil Junior

    You are something else! It has everything to do with knowing the definition of what a bastard is. Question for you: what does a German website have to do with me? Why would I or should I have a need to be commenting on a German website? Please, enlighten me. My argument have all the relevancy because now I see why Roy and Ernie have no tolerance for your ilk and I have come to the conclusion that you are one of those that talk the talk but does the opposite. Like I was taught as a NCO to LEAD BY EXAMPLE, I think with your seniority that you should do the same. Like I said before, I was about to change my mind about you but it is obvious, you are just like the others. No decency. Thanks for the good that you have done and I shall hope you make it home at night to your loved ones.

  • O’neil Junior

    Lol. For some reason, this policeman is clueless. He thinks I am a German. Can you believe that?

  • StevenLNew

    Bla bla more lies form you.
    You claim again I have lied without proof.
    If we KNEW whether or not you had insurance… I would not ask for license, registration and insurance when I pulled people over.

    You ignorance cracks me up. Do you really think I could find you by you telling me what state you are from? This goes to PROVE you are hypersensitive to EVERYTHING and your arguments are definitely not valid any more

    This is exactly why the police get a bad name, Because people like you start lying about things to fill their hatred and so people will actually believe what they are saying. You know as well as I do, this would have came up right off the bat… But you thought you could prove your point without lying, and now that you know you can’t you have turned to lies.
    PS driving without insurance is a BIG deal.
    When you hit someone and if it was your fault… that person now has to pay for everything their self. That’s not fair to them, that’s why it illegal to drive without insurance.
    So go get insurance and stop blaming the cops for you breaking the law.
    You even admitted, that feeding the homeless is illegal but yet you still do it. And then you get mad at the police.
    Speeding is illegal as well and I have done it. I just don’t get mad at the officer who wrote me the ticket when I was breaking the law. Makes no sense.
    If you don’t like the laws, get involved and try to get them changed. Stop complaining because you choose to break the law. You know the consequences if you break the law and you chose to do it. Whether it’s a good cause or not.

  • StevenLNew

    WRONG AGAIN!!! I have multiple identification on me at all times because I’m a cop.
    It’s still your fault for not proving proof of insurance… it’s not the cops fault you can’t do it. AND WE DO NOT KNOW WHETHER OR NOT YOU HAVE INSURANCE WHEN WE PULLED YOU OVER.

  • O’neil Junior

    I can see that now. That’s why I am a proponent for having all these clowns attend an academy for three years to learn the rule of law, the constitution, and have extensive psychology testing before allowing them out on the streets. F ing animals, man. I take that back. I hate dogs but can see loyalty, bravery, compassion, and love in them.

  • O’neil Junior

    It’s laughable. Doesn’t know the law but carries a badge and swore to uphold it. Sad thing is that the majority of the population doesn’t know it either and will say yes to having their things searched because they are coerced into believing what the “nice” policeman says.

  • O’neil Junior

    Hope I never run into him or any like him or their minions!

  • roy

    yeah, i can believe it. he also thinks i don’t have insurance when i plainly stated that i do have insurance. he’s completely nuts. he can’t even form a coherent sentence. he’s a typical ignorant government bully. a totalitarian who doesn’t even know what a totalitarian is! he lies about the cops not having access to whether or not someone has insurance. all you have to do is work on the software installed on cops’ computers for a while and you’ll know they have access to that and everything else they might want to know about you. but then again, he doesn’t know that there are people out there who actually have to be smarter than him…you know, smart enough to actually write the software he uses to oppress people. but then again, maybe he just doesn’t know how to find that information in his computer, eh? or maybe i’m giving away which subset of states i live in by showing that i know that? maybe his state uses different software that doesn’t have that information? either way, he seems like a clueless bully. when i first commented on here it was in defense of someone else who he was talking down to. someone making valid points about how the police violate everyone’s rights. then he started into me because of that. i was happy to distract him from abusing the other guy.

  • roy

    amen.

  • roy

    you’re truly hopeless. and why is it illegal to feed the homeless? because government control freaks like yourself are trying to force everyone to be dependent on the government for everything. you should also know that enforcing that law is a felony. and you once claimed to be Christian. should we not obey God instead of man?

  • O’neil Junior

    In his defense, I will assume this much; maybe his town, county, or city is a poor one that hasn’t caught up with technology, but probably opt for a MRAP, a few SAWs, M4s with grenade launchers, and M240Bs because the police is now the “New Military.” Forget the Posse Comitatus Act. The newest rage is the “no-knock” warrant. Sad that people are now arming themselves against the people that swore to protect them.

  • StevenLNew

    WRONG AGAIN!!!!!!

    1st
    We were talking, and you stated ”here in Germany,” giving me the impression you were from Germany. DUH I am not sure how that confused you.

    2nd
    I am a former Marine 90-95 1st gulf war vet… I was out for several years then decided to go BACK in. Yes it’s just the reserves but don’t act like you know me. I put my life on the line every single day, whether it as a police officer or now as a soldier. I have seen just as much if not far more then you’ve ever seen. I don’t know your military history, so I can’t obviously say, but apparently you know… right?

    Before you judge me ask about my military service.

    Still not sure what this has to do with anything… You are obviously a cop hater… You stated that already. Which coming from a soldier that’s pretty shameful. Seeing that we are the worlds police.

  • StevenLNew

    I’m not the hopeless one… I’m not a cop hater like you.

    1st feeding the homeless is not illegal were I am from. I’ve even told you I do it myself. I’ve even volunteered in a homeless shelter.
    I’ve done it in my squad car as well. So please give me a break. Our department has a food drive every year to feed the needy so please give me a break.

    2nd I don’t make the laws I just try to enforce the laws. So I have no clue why it is illegal to feed the homeless… I’m guessing because there has been issues with it at one time or another or maybe because there are homeless shelters were you can do it legally. But again I don’t enforce that law because here it’s not the law.

    There are things, that if I was asked to do… I wouldn’t do. I would retire if they tried to make me take guns out of people’s homes, or if they told me I couldn’t help the homeless or if I was told to kill someone and it if I was told to infringe on someone’s religious freedoms I would hand them my badge and retire.

    So please stop try to make it sound like a bad guy or cop. It has not worked for you so far. You keep throwing out accusation that are not true and I keep proving you wrong.

  • O’neil Junior

    I am confused because this is what I wrote in part, Steven: “In Germany, the academy for an officer of the law is three years! Some of these guys here do a ride around for two weeks, are given a badge and gun, and have no clue what the Fourth amendment is.” Guy, I care not one iota what you did in the military uniform other than to say thanks for your service, and if you cannot understand what a soldier feels towards the ones that swore to protect his/her loved ones back at home while he or she is away because your other friends are having a heyday playing soldiers against civilians, then, you sir, have a psychological issue. It is NOT RIGHT WHAT THEY ARE DOING!

  • O’neil Junior

    Go and google retirees in Germany working for the US government. Educate yourself instead of gorging on donuts. It is not healthy. You may have a heart attack next time you are chasing someone’s poor innocent child. And as for your “far fetched” assumption, I worked as a CoB at the Hohenfels Training Area before coming back here to deal with people of your ilk!

  • StevenLNew

    So how are you confused on how I thought you are from Germany? If I would have wrote… here in Ohio, the academy for an officer of the law is three years! Some of these guys here do a ride around for two weeks, are given a badge and gun, and have no clue what the Fourth amendment is. Most people would assume I am from Ohio wouldn’t they?

    Now you claim you don’t give one ioda about what other did in my military uniform, but you are the ones who brought that up with false accusations, when you had no clue. Hmmmm and thank you for your service as well.

    This whole post which you started posting on has been about how you think ALL COPS are bad, and I have claimed from the very 1st post… yes there are some bad cops out there but I truly believe the majority are not bad.

    You claim we as police officers are playing soldier… we are what the call paramilitary. Also to highlight with an example… the Hollywood Bank Robbery… please YouTube it watch it, and then tell me that the police didn’t have had to become more military like. I have stated… it’s better to have the equipment and not need it then to need it and not have it.
    Yes or No?

  • roy

    it’s very sad. don’t get me started on the no knock warrant insanity. what’s going to happen when things hit a breaking point? i don’t think these control freaks know what they’re doing to people or why AR’s have been so hard to get for the past couple years. sad indeed, and pretty scary too. let’s just hope it doesn’t escalate any further. i really think the best path is peaceful civil disobedience. keep doing good to your fellow man in plain sight and don’t back down when the government bullies tell you to stop.

  • O’neil Junior

    Good bye, Steven. It was a riot. I have laughed enough. Take care of yourself, and remember what they say! Never assume because it makes an — out of you and me.

  • RiverMikeRat

    Most cops vote Republican.

    Nice try, though. Almost. I personally know several dozen that vote GOP against their own best interests. Their union also tells them to vote GOP so they can keep getting the fun toys to kill and intimidate us with.

    Problem for them is I don’t intimidate easily.

  • RiverMikeRat

    Yeah. Cops are great. Until they refuse to run your descriptors to find out they’re arresting the wrong person.

  • RiverMikeRat

    Don’t pay attention to the news much, do you? CHP officer beat the shit out of a slightly older (50s) lady for walking down a freeway onramp. Caught on video, with him straddling her chest and whaling on her like he’s in UFC or something.

    Video just a day or so ago of two cops whaling on a guy like they’re in prison or something. Just for saying “I’m 911! I’m 911!” You can hear the cops breathing hard and screaming “Quit resisting” as they’re pummeling the guy. You can also hear the witnesses, all of whom were filming “He’s not resisting! Quit killing him!”

    Or, maybe the video of the kid with Downs whose whole face was swollen after the beating he took from a cop.

    Or, what about the NYC cops that gang-raped a Jamaican or Haitian with their batons in the ass?

  • RiverMikeRat

    I know where you live now. Then again, I have a functioning brain.

  • RiverMikeRat

    Cops get a bad name for one of two reasons:
    The do things like Darren WIlson or the cops in St. Louis did/do.
    They don’t out those doing bad or illegal things.

    Silent complicity is still complicity. You don’t speak out when you see other cops breaking the law, you are silently agreeing they have the right to do whatever they want and are above the law.

    Guess what? You aren’t, legally. But unless one of you crosses the line and abuses another cop or their family, you close ranks and support the dirty.

  • RiverMikeRat

    Most of the jurisdictions say it is a “health hazard” to set up a kitchen in a park and feed the homeless, or hand out store bought or homemade sandwiches. I know Tucson PD took in about 10 members of a homeless support group, who are all friends of mine, earlier this year for doing just that: Bringing homemade sandwiches and kool-aid to a park and giving them out to the homeless.

    Yes, there are shelters available, but they are closed between 7-8AM and about 4-5PM, meaning the homeless don’t get to eat lunch. Those shelters don’t give out a lunch unless the person is working. I know this because I was homeless in Tucson for more than 2 years.

  • RiverMikeRat

    A dialect is a version of a language. Like Szechuan or Cantonese. You wanted dialog, which is a conversation. You wrote “were” several times when you should have written “where.” I can go on.

    You’re right. Not ALL cops are dirty/bad. But, how often do we see where a cop does something heinous (that means worse than terrible) and the rest of the force/department closes ranks and protects them instead of outing them? The only time I’ve seen it in recent history was when an Illinois cop caught one of his fellow officers sexually abusing his children (His, not the abuser’s) at a BBQ.

    Cop shoots innocent kid with no gun? “He was threatening us and we thought he had a gun.”

    Cop pulls someone through their car window and beats them senseless? “He was resisting arrest!”

    Cop beats the snot out of a teenager with Downs for getting upset? “He was mentally unstable and threatening!”

    And then we have Ferguson: “He had just performed a strong arm robbery and was walking in the street and yelled at the cop.”

    Except, thanks to the owner of the store in question, we know the dead teen paid for the items he was supposed to have stolen. We also see from the autopsy report that the teen was no threat, was actually running away or surrendering. “He was a thug! The cop suffered a broken occipital lobe (The bone around the eye.)” Except, we now know THAT was a lie, also. And there were no offensive or defensive wounds on the deceased, except bullet holes.

    Or, guy walks into convenience store and walks out with two sodas without paying. Nothing happens. Guy goes back in and walks out with a couple pieces of candy and places everything on sidewalk, waiting for cops to arrive. Cops arrive and immediately pull weapons. Guy turns around and repositions himself so he is not directly between cops and bystanders. Guy then takes two or three steps from about 5 meters away and yells “Shoot me!” Cops oblige, 7 times, 4 of which were after he was on the ground. Then cuff him and let him bleed out. Cops say there was a knife, but none is visible in the 3 video clips circulating on YouTube. Cops form ranks to protect the killers saying the dead guy ran at the cops holding a knife in an overhand grip saying he’s going to kill them. Except, none of the video backs that up. Still, no cop comes forward and even hints that it might have been an excessive use of force.

    THAT is why public opinion is turning against cops.

  • RiverMikeRat

    He wouldn’t chase. He’d step out of the vehicle, calmly draw his weapon and fire off his whole clip.

  • RiverMikeRat

    Ooopsie. I call bullshit.

    1: If you were a Marine, you would NEVER have called yourself a “former Marine.”
    2: IF you were a Marine, you would never have called yourself a soldier and especially not twice. I know Marines that have fought people over that distinction. My late uncle up to the day he died at about 90 called himself a Marine, and he was a draftee Marine for Vietnam.

    So, respectfully officer (sneer, laugh) you’re full of shit.

  • RiverMikeRat

    ANY cop that protects the wrongdoing of fellow officers is just as guilty and just as dirty. How often have you gone public and spoken about the wrongdoing of fellow officers in your department? I’m betting you hide right behind that Thin Blue Line just like the vast majority of them.

    The last ‘good” cop was Serpico. And look what happened to him. (Yes, it was based upon a true story.)

  • RiverMikeRat

    Retired Navy. Ex-wife and grown kids. Sold the house and moved to Brazil because it’s safer. At least here cops only shoot people that they positively identify as having weapons, at least in my experience.

  • RiverMikeRat

    Incorrect Craig. California Vehicle Code requires drivers to obey posted limits.

    Also incorrect in that most cops don’t even know the few Code items that pertain to their traffic enforcement duties. I’ve been pulled over too many times to count before I left the states “Excuse me sir, you know that “this” is illegal.”

    “No,officer it isn’t. Here’s why, section and paragraph and all.”

    “Smart ass!”

    “Call your sergeant or watch commander please. Immediately.”

  • RiverMikeRat

    Probable cause has requirements also. And they can search with proper probable cause.

  • StevenLNew

    Your point is not valid at all… I have seen police officers who have gone to jail, and they deserve it. Who do you think arrests police officers that break the law? Police Officers do.

    I have never said there are no bad cops out there. I do think the majority are not bad.

    How do you know the Darrin Wilson is even guilty without all the evidence? You have convicted him already why? The evidence has been changing all the time… witnesses are coming out say he was being attacked… I don’t claim to know, but at least I will wait for the facts to come out, and if it cont out that officer Wilson is in the wrong… May God have mercy on his sole.

  • StevenLNew

    I lived there myself for 4 years and I have been one of those people who have given sandwiches out tithe homeless. Granted that was in the 90’s. But you said it yourself. There is a reason whether it is health hazard or something else. I’m not saying people should stop… I’m just saying be prepared to pay the fine if caught.
    It like missionaries who go to counties where being a Christian is illegal, they know the risk when they go in, and they except the risk. Like when I paid for someone’s gas when they drive off, instead of taking them to jail… I would it again and I know the risk. But I expect that risk.

  • StevenLNew

    My whole point exactly… Not ALL cops are bad… yes there are bad cops out there. I have had my own personal people I called friends… one Who while working in the took advantage of a girl… Who admitted she was asking him for it… (But it’s still illegal) he was fired on the spot, and I erased him from my Facebook my address book and I have nothing to do with him, a week later he was arrested for it. There is another deputy in our jail now, who caught his wife cheating he hit her and pointed his gun at her… they called us in s.w.a.t. And he was arrested on the spot, and later fired. He is still in our jail 9 months later.
    So not everyone close ranks and backs them up.

  • RiverMikeRat

    Wow. English really isn’t a strong suit for you, is it?

    Please, I’d love for you to provide some proof of cops being arrested for their wrongdoing. I’ve only seen or heard of one instance in the past 10 years or so, but have seen several hundred instances where it should have happened.

    May god have mercy on his sole? Does he have flat feet or something? Or maybe a pet fish?

    The independent autopsy has shown that Michael Brown was either shot while running away (fleeing) or while surrendering with his hands up.

    The same autopsy also showed that the coup de grace came from an angle that indicates the shooter was either standing over the victim, or the victim was lying on his face.

    The law states that the officer may only use deadly force when there is an imminent threat to him or the public. An unarmed suspect that is fleeing doesn’t present an imminent threat to anyone.

    However, with that being said, there are some pretty crazy laws in Missouri that may end up letting Wilson off the hook. Such as: An officer doesn’t have to fear for his life or public safety in order to use deadly force.

    Also, new audio has been released that has two separate and distinct sets of shots. 5 or 6 in a row, quickly, and then 3 more a couple ticks later, enough time for the cop to approach the victim and shoot him, execution style, in the top of the head.

    The ONLY evidence we don’t have yet is the autopsy performed by the local coroner, tox reports (which have no bearing on anything in the case) and the chemical analysis of Brown’s clothing.

    One other thing: The independent autopsy stated that there are no powder burns or powder residue on the body of Michael Brown, absolutely refuting the statement of Wilson that his first shots at Brown were when he was being attacked.

    Wilson also said that Brown was trying to go for his (Wilson’s) weapon during the attack, but his weapon was on the inner side, center side of the vehicle, meaning Brown would have had to have had most of his big body through the small window of the cop car laying across Wilson’s body. Completely unbelievable.

    I’ve never said all cops were bad. What I have said many times and continue to say is that any cop that allows another to get away with violating the law or the rights of civilians is just as culpable (guilty) as those breaking the law or committing the violations.

  • StevenLNew

    Well obviously you were never a Marine.
    We don’t call ourselves ex-marine we call ourselves former Marines. Yes once a Marine always a Marine, but the proper way to say I’m a Marine who is no longer servings as a Marine is to say I’m a former Marine.
    My unit now is full of former marines. Once you leave the Corps and join the Army, you still become a soldier. Nothing you can do about that. I still fly my marine flag on my home and my truck.

  • StevenLNew

    What in the Heck are you taking about… I stated… time and time again… There are BAD cops out there. But you even said yourself… Not ALL cops are bad… that’s the whole point. If those officers are found to be guilty… I hope they rot in prison.
    What does that have to do with me watching the news?

  • RiverMikeRat

    Cool. Thank you. You are a rare one. I’ve heard cop telling me they will protect one of their own no matter what, unless they mess with one of their own or the family of one of their own.

    That makes you and your department appear to be a rarity these days. I honestly commend you and your department.

    Again, thank you.

    P.S. I know it’s a hard and thankless job. I’m hoping you can see why it is thankless. And that you continue to work to change that. I used to look up to cops. I wouldn’t mind being able to again.

  • levria loveless

    not true-

    most cops are union-

    union votes dnc-

    nice try though-

    poor people have been voting democrat for 100 years and are still poor-

    jeepers-

  • levria loveless

    wow-

    so after all that make believe are you going to-

    take the trolley and go see king Friday with all the other libs?

  • levria loveless

    ahh brazil-

    home of phagettes and sailors-

    makes sense you and your “partner” made the right choice-

    At least that smell is not in the USA!

    Hey tanks rat mike!

  • RiverMikeRat

    Actually, poor people have only been voting Dem since the mid-sixties. Also, there are more dirt poor Republicans than there are dirt poor Dems. Look at state by state demographics. You’ll find most of them in the deep South voting Republican, against their better interests.

    Also, most cops, while union, vote Republican. I know several dozen, as I stated, and only one votes Dem.

    Loveless is right.

    Oh, I was a diehard GOP voter through the first part of the 80s AND a union member. Machinists and Aerospace, Santa Clara County.

    I can’t even come close to saying “nice try” for you.

  • levria loveless

    really is that when fdr became president?

  • peter watts

    I understand what you are saying, and I wasn’t trying to be the grammar police. In my career I’ve read thousands of police reports from many different agencies and nearly all cops write in a similar style and tenor. In my somewhat knowledgeable opinion, Steven isn’t a real cop. Most likely, he works security.

  • RiverMikeRat

    Holy farking shite! You really are clueless, aren’t you?

    I’m done. I don’t interact with absolute idiots.

  • roy

    i know the judicial precedence in regard to that and i’m not going to dispute that they do them, but the constitution has no provision for it. that’s the point i was making. he said he follows the constitution. you can go see the “conversation” i’ve had with this guy throughout this to see how he interprets it as the opposite of what it says.

  • roy

    so you’ve made me, eh? are you going to turn me in for feeding the homeless?

  • roy

    you’ve got to admit that it doesn’t make sense that poor people voting dem only started in the 60’s. most poor people during FDR’s reign of confiscation and price fixing kept voting for him…especially the south. the records i know most about personally is that almost all of michigan used to vote for him because of the unions. it sounds kinda crazy to say that they only started voting dem in the 60’s given the evidence and the fact that southerners, especially the poor, were known to always vote democrat before the 60’s. they only switched to republican in the 60’s in the south because of the civil rights issue. the crazy thing is: the president who finally gave in and signed the civil rights laws was a democrat, but it was a republican congress that had constantly been trying to get them made into law, facing staunch opposition from the democrats the whole time. why the switch? go look up who was president and what he said about signing it! you’ve got to admit that both parties are whacked. one purports to care about financial and religious freedom and the other purports to care about the other civil liberties. and they both try to limit everyone’s freedom in the way the other party claims to want reedom. but as Ron Paul once said regarding civil liberties and economic liberty: “aren’t they the same?” btw, the biggest opponents johnson had were all democrats. before the 60’s, the south was vigilently hating the republlican party because of lincoln, the civil war, and the freeing of the slaves.

  • O’neil Junior

    Sad thing is that that is the reality of today’s mindset of the police.

  • O’neil Junior

    I guess he is a nice person…out of uniform. But like instant asshole, just add badge and gun.

  • O’neil Junior

    That I do believe wholeheartedly, man. Sad when the general public is afraid of the police. Approached one in Houston last year to ask for direction because I am not from there. The attitude and stare I got was reprehensible! My girlfriend at the time was visiting me from Germany and she asked me why he behaved like that. I had no explanation to give her other than, “that’s the way police are in the US.”

  • RiverMikeRat

    Yep. I’ve actually found them to be much more friendly and accommodating here in Brazil, although most Brazilians have told me to be careful around them.

  • levria loveless

    Wow-

    you are the reason-

    You dont want to look at facts-

    You want to ignore history and pretend poor people haven’t been voting democrat for a long long time and are still poor and in no better shape,
    Either educationally or financially than they where 60-100 years ago.

    The dnc is only in it for the $$$-

    They dont care how or at what costs to the people of this country,
    they obtain their goals-
    or even if they

    Ruin this great nation-

    shame on you.

  • O’neil Junior

    Yes, they can also be a little nasty. Check this one out:
    http://m.huffpost.com/us/entry/5721728

  • Ernie

    Actually, Penis, my life is great. It’s people like you who are allowing our liberties to gradually disappear. The US Constitution is what prevents authorities compelling us to answer questions. It’s our shltty public education system that has allowed you to be ignorant of that, and other facts.

  • peter watts

    The name is Peter, not Penis, Ernie. I guess we know what you are thinking about, don’t we? Anyway, back to your issues with answering simple questions. Yes, you have a right to remain silent. But don’t be surprised when you keep your mouth shut for questions like your name and address and you create reasonable suspicion that you may be involved in the crime that is being investigated. That suspicion will result in you being detained and potentially arrested. But you know better, so I would suggest you keep your mouth shut and be suspected a fool than open it and remove all doubts. You are still a dick.

  • Ernie

    OK – it’s OK for you to call me a dick, but not OK for me to call you a Penis. It sounds to me like you are one of those good for nothing cops I’ve been talking about. Not that it should matter to you, but I am fully aware of my rights and obligations – more so than most of the cops I encounter. Either that, or the cops are aware of my rights, and willingly choose to ignore them, which supports my thesis that the vast majority of cops a sneaky, lying bastards.

    I’ll gladly allow you the last word, since I have no need to justify myself to the like of a low-life like you. I will continue to exercise my freedom.

  • Reese Barnes

    Do you know why I pulled you over today ?

    Because the bureaucrats that run the government like to use the police as heavily armed glorified meter maids to extract additional revenues from the public through B.S. fines, fees and regulations ?

  • MrWonderful61

    Here is an excellent argument for the “don’t talk to the police” advice (which I firmly agree with, by the way):

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6wXkI4t7nuc

  • Madeline Grace

    If you really listen to this guy. He sounds like he is talking to the guilty. If you are guilty. Don’t talk to the police, and I would agree if I was a guilty person. Lois Learner. Plead the 5th after she made a statement about how she had done nothing wrong. Which is not how you plea the 5th. You plea the 5th before and during the whole questioning
    If you haven’t done anything wrong I don’t believe you need to plea the 5th..

  • StevenLNew

    So… If you see your neighbor… Rape some innocent girl walking her dog, and the police come to your house to see if you may know something or seen something… You are telling me, you would not answer the police officers question?
    You my friend are an idot!!! Because that is what you and this dude are telling the everyone they should do.
    As Madeline just stated… If you have just commited a crime… You probably shouldn’t speak. DUH… No one is arguing that. BUT if you haven’t done anything wrong, you should have NO FEAR in talking to the police.

  • MrWonderful61

    Well, Steve… you can do as you like. However, if you actually watched the video, and THAT is what you came away with, then you, sir, are most likely the idiot in this conversation.

    The article is titled “What NOT to do When Being Pulled Over,” not “How to Respond When Your Innocent Neighbor Girl is Raped While Walking Her Dog.”

    But, even then, the video explains that you STILL may get into trouble by offering testimony. So weigh the risks and do as you like.

    Or don’t, I don’t really care.

  • MrWonderful61

    Beliefs can get you into trouble, especially when dealing with the police. I understand how you could get that impression he’s only speaking to the guilty, but I seem to recall that he listed SEVERAL scenarios in which you could be totally innocent, yet still bring unwanted scrutiny, if not actual charges, upon yourself.

    If you missed those parts, maybe you should watch it again. 😉

  • Madeline Grace

    It was a very long video… 48 minutes. I doubt anyone watch the full video

  • StevenLNew

    Well you are the one who brought up this video… None of
    the stuff in this video had to do with an actual car stop. Maybe during an interrogation… But not a routine care stop.

    Most of the examples in this video where from the 70’ and 80’s
    and the confessions came while they being interrogated by the detectives. Which
    I would agree with you… IF you are being interrogated… By all means lawyer up… I would. It means the police think you’ve done something wrong.

  • StevenLNew

    I agree way to long, but it wasn’t too bad

  • MrWonderful61

    Ok, I quit.
    If you don’t even realize that you are testifying ANY time you are talking to a police officer, AND that whenever a police officer asks you ANY question that you ARE BEING INTERROGATED, then there is no hope for you.

    Good luck being you.

  • MrWonderful61

    Yes, I know. 48 minutes is a long time for a generation with ADHD. Almost no one could possibly watch a 48 minute video, I mean, what was I thinking?!?

    What I originally posted was essentially “here’s a video that supports the position that you should never talk to the police.”

    Watch it.
    Don’t watch it.
    I don’t really care.

    But don’t comment on it until you’ve actually watched it. Anything less is disingenuous.

  • StevenLNew

    Well obviously there is no hope you…
    You are right I am a police officer… And you are right and wrong.
    Wrong: Just because I ask someone a question, does NOT mean they are being interrogated.
    Right: I do sometimes write on the back of a ticket, but usually only for 2 reasons… 1) for example, if I stopped you and you don’t have an updated insurance card, but you swear to me you do, I will write on the back, claims he has valid insurance, then I explain to them to bring it with them to court and if was valid I would ask the judge to dismiss that charge.
    OR 2) if you start spouting how stupid I am and and his dad is a judge and he will get out of this ticket. I let them know I am writing what he says on the back.

    All and all, me asking a question doesn’t mean anything… the ONLY time you are being interrogated by me is if I read you your rights. That’s when it becomes an integration.

  • MrWonderful61

    Ok, so the terms “Declaration against interest” and “party admission” don’t mean anything to you?

    You probably don’t even mind if a driver has a radar detector on display on their dash.

    You sound like a great guy. No, really!

  • StevenLNew

    Well obviously you don’t really know or you don’t understand Declaration again interest.

    Here let me help you out.

    Declarations against interest are an exception to the rule on hearsay in which a person’s statement may be used, where generally the content of the statement is so prejudicial to the person making it that he would not have made the statement unless he believed the statement was true. The Federal Rules of evidence limit the bases of prejudices to the declarant to tort and criminal liability. Some states, such as California, extend the prejudice to “hatred, ridicule, or social disgrace in the community.”

    And you are absolutely correct… I don’t care at all if you have a radar detector in your car… not sure what that has to do with anything. It’s not illegal in my state or in most states.

  • MrWonderful61

    Color me impressed. You DO know about legal proceedings.

    Yes, well, my only point was that in many instances, conversations with law enforcement types, outside of an official “interrogation,” could still present an opportunity to implicate oneself, either rightly or wrongly.

    As an aside, you might find this site very interesting:
    vice.com/read/testilying-cops-are-liars-who-get-away-with-perjury

    I’ve included an excerpt here:

    > A 1987 study from Chicago found that 76 percent of officers agreed that that they frequently bent the facts to establish probable cause; 48 percent said that judges were right in tossing police testimony as untrustworthy.

    > Judge Alex Kozinski of the United States Court of Appeals for the Ninth Circuit, publicly stated in the 1990s:

    > “It is an open secret long shared by prosecutors, defense lawyers, and judges that perjury is widespread among law enforcement officers … police lie to avoid letting someone they think is guilty, or they know is guilty, go free.”

    Good day, Deputy & travel safe!

  • smartacus

    All public police functions can be privatized, contracted out, or reassigned.

  • smartacus

    policemisconduct .net

  • Zompano

    I left N.J. Because it has turned into a police state. The garden state was called that years ago because the revenue to run the state was through farming, now the main revenue comes from traffic violations. Most people don’t know that the turnpike and parkway are on a quota system. The cops in n.j. After. 5 yrs make around 100,000 per yr. a bit much I think, but to justify this salary they, the cops , must write so many tickets. Kinda sucks that they prey on the public. So glad I no longer live there. I am not a criminal but a contractor with trucks. Perfect shape totally legal in every respect. The Jackson police are a real goon squad, that has run roughshod on the population. The system is difficult because just as a citizen the deck is stacked against you. What a pleasure not to live there any longer.

  • propwash

    Should also mention that if you have a handgun or any firearm anywhere in the car, keep your hands on the wheel and as soon as the officer approaches, advise him of that fact. If you have a CCW, it will probably go well. If you don’t then that will just add to your grief.

  • RiverMikeRat

    I moved to Brazil.

  • FlashF

    Good thing the state i live in does not require automobile insurance (or seat belts either). LIVE FREE OR DIE.

  • FlashF

    I agree…NJ sucks. I avoid going into that state.

  • Tom Davis

    Never dare the officer to give you a ticket.

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